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{{sockpuppeteer |blocked|checked=yes}}
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There are at least two kinds of games.
<div class="boilerplate metadata" id="Response location" style="{{divstyleamber}}" align="center" >I will respond on this page to comments, unless you ask that I respond on your talk page.</div>
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One could be called finite, the other infinite.
{{cquote|<big>I have always been among those who believed that the greatest freedom of speech was the greatest safety, because if a man is a fool the best thing to do is to encourage him to advertise the fact by speaking.</big>|20px | 20px|]
28th President of the United States}}


The finite game is played for the purpose of winning, and thereby ending the game.
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{{user new message|name=Jossi}}


An infinite game for the purpose of continuing the play ... and bringing as many persons as possible into the play.
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Finite players play ''within'' boundaries; infinite players play ''with'' boundaries.
{{totd}}


Finite players are serious; infinite games are playful.
==hi!==
{{smile|frummer}}


Finite players try to control the game, predict everything that will happen, and set the outcome in advance. They are serious and determined about getting that outcome. They try to fix the future based on the past.
==Coca-cola==
actually, jossi. the coca-cola page was hacked and there was no code with the hack on it so i guess it was some like fixed hack thing.
sorry you missunderstood.


Infinite players enjoy being surprised. Continuously running into something they didn't know will ensure that the game will go on. The meaning of the past changes depending on what happens in the future.
i have a wikipedia account its ryryion theryes nothing wrong i would never mess wikipedia up its helped me with alot of papers.


All games are inherently voluntary. There might be consequences of not playing, but there is always a choice required. There are certain rules and boundaries that appear to be externally defined, and you choose to follow them or not. If you stop following them you aren't playing the game any longer.
thanks


There is no rule that says you have to follow the rules, and there is no rule that says you have to play. If you ''have to'' play, you cannot ''really'' play.
ryan..


All finite games have rules. If you follow the rules you are playing the game. If you don't follow the rules you aren't playing.
(screen name (aol) westoceanlove16){{unsigned|207.255.183.240}}


Infinite players play with rules and boundaries. They aren't taking them serious, and they can never be trapped by them, because they use rules and boundaries as part of their playing.
==Jossi, please look at Generation Rescue talk page==


Players can do what they do seriously, because they must do it, because they must survive to the end, and are afraid of the consequences of not playing or not winning. Or, players can do everything they do playfully, always knowing they have a choice, having no need to survive the way they are, allowing every element of the play to transform them, taking pleasure in every surprise they meet. Those are the differences between finite and infinite players.
We think we have materially improved the citation, and that problems have been created by people who violently disagree with Generation Rescue and want a very slanted entry. All we want is a Wiki page that is neutral and presents BOTH sides of the organization.{{unsigned|Staff Writer Wiki}}


You can play finite games within an infinite game. You can not play infinite games within a finite game.
==Request for Comment: Regarding subcategory title==
Please give your comment / suggestions regarding this in the Sathya Sai talk page. I have also requested comments from other editors. ] 22nd February 2007


There is only but one infinite game.
You comments relating to an edit on Leonardo.
1. I bow to your editorial skill
2. I believe you are in error and obviously uninformed on recent theories regarding DaVinci's Mona Lisa. Therefore I would request you retract you comment of Vandalism as it is unwarranted. There was no nonsense in the comments appended. If you still believe there was, please be specific.
I thank you for you concern and applaud you contributions but I do not want you to believe there was nonsense or malice. I would be pleased to have had the opportunity to append cites to support my comment had you not voided them. I would hope that actions were not homophobic and assume you are not involved in art history. I am university educated with an art history minor from Columbia University, N.Y. and studied in Italy as well.
In any event, best regards. denidoc@gmail.com


''Paraphrased from James P. Carse, ] ''
== Prince Henry ==


] <small>]</small>
I will try to follow your suggestions. However, let me point out that the first to insult with vulgar terms like "asshole" was Dr. Lisboa. And it is difficult not to attack a poster who is constantly wrong, refuses to acknowledge his errors, and simply persists in them or drops one error and creates new ones. In short, how gladly must one suffer fools?
----
''''<br />Very sorry to see you leave, Jossi. I fully respect your decision to retire, but do know that I would be very happy to see you make a return to actively contributing at some point.<br />My very best, ] 10:14, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
:As would I. I disagreed with some of your decisions, but think you have much to offer the community and the Project. Don't let some sour grapes disinterest you - make grappa! :) - ] ] 15:30, 23 December 2008 (UTC)
:I am sorry to see you leave the project; you were a valuable asset to this community. Best wishes, <small>] &#x007C; ] &#x007C; ]</small> 00:14, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
::Your actions were benevolent, reasoned and always truthful, in my mind; it is a surprise that you departed so suddenly. It is a real shame you have left. Good luck. ] 00:19, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
:::(As above, please move or remove this message at your discretion if you don't want it here.) I can't say we always got along, but I certainly always was glad to see you in a difficult situation. Best of luck to you, wherever that great infinite game takes you. ] <small><sup>]</sup></small> 03:10, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
::::I am very sorry to see you go. When I was a newbie you were extraordinarily kind and patient with me and I greatly appreciated it. Best of luck to you! ] (]) 13:08, 24 December 2008 (UTC)


Sorry, I'm a bit thick sometimes. So, hum, real life is the only infinite game, wikipedia is a finite game. Since wikipedia is a finite game, at some point in wikipedia's game you stop running into surprising stuff that you didn't know about, and players wind up being being trapped by wikipedia's rules, being afraid of consequences of not "winning", etc. Text between lines: wikipedia ougth to be an infinite game, but it's not. Did I get it right? --] (]) 14:06, 29 December 2008 (UTC)
----professional historian who has corrected Dr. Lisboa's many errors.


:Close, Enric ...
== Another "Dr" Lisboa on Prince Henry the Navigator complaint ==
This has nothing to do with the content of the article, but simply the unneccesary insult directed toward me on the talk page. I noticed your post there, and this seems to be the only way of contacting you. I refuse to take abuse from another person, virtual or otherwise. Thank you.


:Look at it this way, ''collaboration'' is the antithesis of ''winning''. Players in a game can be focused in terminating the game by winning or by declaring once side as the loser. In collaboration, all players are focused intently in keeping the game going.
== Calligraphy==
Hi Jossi. I note tonight that someone put a spam notice at the bottom of the Calligraphy page. I hope it was not you ? I have done most of the editing recently- I have contacted some 3rd parties about their own sites that I have put links to. My judgement is that the assistance and educational value of the ones chosen is significant. There are a number of editing decisions that I have made that exclude content on the basis of it being an invitation for all and sundry to post their own sites or books. I recommend that if someone has a specific objection that they make it public. Otherwise I think we're on the right track. What do you think about the prominent calligraphers list ? I don't think that it is useful and again poses a threat to the credibility of the main site. ayou may wish to read my recent contributions on the discussion board regarding some of the things I have had to correct- one example includes changing a short, direct quotation from a reputable source into a misquotation. Can we have a look at introducing some new images and perhaps removing "Urkunde" ? Please respond on my talk page. Regards.≈ Furminger ≈ 19 April 2007
:I did not touch that article for a while. For an guideline on what is acceptable as an external link, see ]. ] <small>]</small>


:Misplaced Pages is indeed a finite game, but has embodied many traits of an infinite game. For example , there is ]: ''If a rule prevents you from improving or maintaining Misplaced Pages, ignore it.'', i.e. if a rule prevents the game to continue, ignore it. The challenge is, thought, as Misplaced Pages grows in importance, authority, and reach, it's basic principles of collegial collaboration, civility, ''anybody can edit'', free content, and neutral point of view (]) are being challenged by more traditional forces, which I would call ''routinization''. This routinization is visible in the quite large body of policies, guidelines, manuals of style, etc. that has developed as well as the processes developed to keep the game going: Arbitration, Administrators, Page protection, Bans, Blocks etc. (Note that I am not judging that to be good or bad, simply stating a fact: after all I was quite involved in these aspects myself. )
== IRC cloak request ==
I am jossi on freenode and I would like the cloak wikipedia/jossi Thanks. --~ ] <small>]</small>


:As soon as these routinizing aspects begin consuming too many resources — and in WP the ''only'' resource is volunteer time (besides $$ needed to run the servers and keep a small staff) — the purpose of the game begin to be lost: Rather than build new articles, improve new ones, expand the number of players, encourage participation, etc. the most experienced people and those with most time, tend to spend their wiki-time in areas that ''limit'' play. I am not arguing that these tasks are not needed; they are. Only that over time, the fundamental principles of Misplaced Pages get lost or constrained in such a manner that it impinges in these principles and may eventually lead to terminating play. As an editor that invested quite a bit of time in that area, I am aware of the dichotomy it presents and the challenges in bridging it.
== backdrop on Stephan Sinding pages ==


:Another challenge is when players try to bring about other games into Misplaced Pages than Wikpiedia's own. Players try and transpose the games they have chosen to play IRL, into this project. That is why we have ], the other side of ]. Just witness the ongoing political, scientific, religious, and other such disputes that have been developing over the last years (check ] for a good sample), and the many efforts by the community to overcome these challenges. A notable point is that in almost every arbitration case (with some notable exceptions), the result is the ''imposition of restrictions'' to participate fully in the game ... "in order to continue playing, you are now restricted from playing", an obvious contradiction.


:So, as long as there are editors that will do everything possible to keep the game going, and do that with such grace and diligence that does not result in restricting play, Misplaced Pages may have a chance. But if these editors that are intent in winning the game at the expense of keeping the playing going, become those that steer the project forward, then it may not. My opinion is that Misplaced Pages is at that cross-road. The new Arbitration committee, which IMO has more diversity than ever before, as well as having people that I admire for the brilliance of their minds and the generosity of their hearts, may be the ones tasked to see this through, that is if they managed to bring the community around to support their efforts when exploring these challenges.
how are you, i was at the help desk and couldn't find stuff on taking down a photo just 4.11 Uploading a photo. I wasn't the one who took down the "Kjærlighetspar" photo on the intimacy page, i just signed out of my accout to post a myspace and youtube vandal pic hoping someone would take down all the pics seeing how none of the pics are specific to the intimacy sentences. it worked, but on the Stephan Sinding page the back frame and caption for the pict "Kjærlighetspar" ("Loving couple") is still up just like on the intimacy article. i think the pics were deleted by you since User:Jossi was the last undo, and a administrator. can you send some pointers on how to get rid of that backdrop on Stephan Sinding pages and not just take them down Please.


:Per Carse, it boils down to ''choice'' If you ''have'' to play, you ''cannot'' play. It seems that those that want to win the game, are usually those that feel ''compelled'' to play it, and are those that play it too seriously for their own good. And those that want to keep the game going are usually those that edit with a smile on they face, enjoying the game, bringing new players to the game and expanding the possibility of play.
pict frame backdrop on Stephan Sinding pages


:So, my decision to retire is based on that choice: ''because I can''. I said this without judgment of other players: I wish them wisdom in their own choices, playfulness in their play, and my best.
== Stephan Sinding pages, thanks. ==


:Happy New Year,
sorry for that long letter since you werent even the one who undid the last message. i didnt even notice the ] on the ] if your the one who got intouch with User:Ziji to take down the back pict frame on the Stephan Sinding pages, thanks. {{unsigned|68.175.95.66}}


:] <small>]</small> 18:24, 29 December 2008 (UTC)
== How do I ask for protection on (a) page(s)? ==


::Well, I'm happy that you are not retiring because of bitterness. Myself, I'm staying if only because I can't resist seeing all the process first hand , you know, watching train crashes in slow motion :) I don't understand everything that you say, but I'll take your comments and try to be more playful on my editing. --] (]) 21:28, 25 January 2009 (UTC)
How do i ask for protection on a page?


::: Although I'm only seeing your edits now after you have left I'm also sorry to see you go and hope you reconsider in due course. You may be happy to know that I'm making some progress with COI reform (one small step at a time), for example ] and ]. Perhaps you would consider helping out with such things, if not involving yourself in editing as such. In particular you and I share the view of volunteer time being a precious resource while 1's and 0's are a commodity, and I hope to "leverage" my contributions by trimming back some of the areas where time is wasted (e.g. 50k AfDs over 5k articles). Would you consider helping me write an essay on "respect for human time" or similar? -- <u style="text-decoration:none; font-family: papyrus;">] <small>]]</small></u> 13:17, 10 March 2009 (UTC)
Please reply on my talk page


== Seasons Greetings ==
== WikiProject Biography Summer 2007 Assessment Drive ==


] (]) 00:07, 25 December 2008 (UTC)]]
<div style="border: 2px solid #484898; background: #FFF; background-color:#E2E7FF; padding: 1ex 1ex 1ex 1.5ex; margin: 0px 0px 1em 1em; font-size: 90%">
<div style="border-bottom: 2px dotted #484898">'''WikiProject Biography Summer 2007 Assessment Drive!'''</div>
]
] is holding a '''three month long''' assessment drive!<br>
The goal of this drive is to '''eliminate''' the backlog of unassessed articles. The drive is running from June 1, 2007 – September 1, 2007.


== Vaya con Dios ==
Awards to be won range from delicacies such as the ] to the great ].<br>
There are '''over 110,000''' articles to assess so please visit the ] and help out!


Hasta luego, amigo. If I may be so bold, I hope that you made your decision to leave for the sake of your own spiritual health and not in the hopes of influencing Misplaced Pages. Because even a token participation here on your part would be infinitely more helpful than leaving. But if you left because you felt that continued participation was not in the best interests of your continued spiritual growth then I am with you, brother. I will hang in, though. Best Holiday Wishes. --] (]) 18:31, 28 December 2008 (UTC)
This drive was conceived of and organized by ] with the help of ]. Regards, '''<font face="Kristen ITC">]'''<sup>] ]</sup></font>.
</div>


--Take care dude, don't neglect your video games and remember to have crazy fun on the weekends.
== Article Protection ==
tilda tilda tilda tilda <small><span class="autosigned">—Preceding ] comment added by ] (] • ]) 07:32, 5 January 2009 (UTC)</span></small><!-- Template:Unsigned --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->


== Admin templates on userpage ==
Please can you justify how issues regarding the trademark is relavant to the Royal Bengal Airline article? Please could you very kindly review this again and cut this out? Thank you.{{unsigned|Airphantom }}


Hello, I have removed your admin templates on your userpage as you are not an administrator. I noticed your retirement message - perhaps you just forgot to remove them before leaving. Any queries, please don't hesitate to contact me. :) <span style="font-family:Trebuchet MS;"><b>&mdash; ]</b><sup><i>]</i></sup></span> 00:44, 31 December 2008 (UTC)
== Can you please help me - again ==


==An olive branch==
Hi. On the ] page there has been a debate going on about that there was no citing on whether he attended the school. One has been made, but how do we know that she isn't just lying to make sure it stays on? Surely there must be more than just writing something down and giving it an un-proven cite and that makes it able to be kept on. Can you explain to me more on that situation of whether you can just write it down or you have to actually have physical proof.


{| style="border: 1px solid gray; background-color: #fdffe7;"
Sorry, some people must think they are you as they are asking a question I am asking you.
|rowspan="2" valign="middle" | ]
|rowspan="2" |
|style="font-size: x-large; padding: 0; vertical-align: middle; height: 1.1em;" | '''Peace'''
|-
|style="vertical-align: middle; border-top: 1px solid gray;" | Best wishes for the New Year. &nbsp; <b>]&nbsp; ]&nbsp; </b> 18:41, 31 December 2008 (UTC)
|}


==Best wishes==
== my edit to ] ==
I'm sorry to see that your positive experiences with Misplaced Pages were overtaken by negative ones. I too am very sorry to see you leave. Perhaps time away will allow you to come to terms with how things turned out. If that itch to contribute to Misplaced Pages ever comes back, a good way to regain your joy of contribution might be to look over your earliest contributions and follow along the path to where you realized that this is where you wanted to be. Best wishes. -- ] ] 16:27, 2 January 2009 (UTC)
== An article you created maybe deleted soon: Tools which can help you ==


] The article you created: ''']''' may be deleted from Misplaced Pages.
Might I point out the line concerning "Berticus the great"?


There is an ongoing debate about whether your article should be deleted here:
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:* '''].'''
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The faster you respond, the better chance the article you created can be saved.
{{{1|]}}} has smiled at you! Smiles promote ] and hopefully this one has made your day better. Spread the WikiLove by smiling at someone else, whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past or a good friend. Happy editing! {{{2|}}} <br /> Smile at others by adding {{tls|Smile}} to their talk page with a friendly message.
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Thanks for saying hello.


Finding sources which mention the topic of your article is the '''very best way''' to avoid an article being deleted {{tl|Findsources3}}: ]
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Also, there are several tools and helpful editors on Misplaced Pages who can help you:
== deleted help page ==
# List the page up for deletion on ]. You can get help listing your page on the <span class="plainlinks"></span>.
# You can request a mentor to help explain all of the complex rules that editors use to get a page deleted: ]. But '''don't''' wait for a mentor to respond to you before responding on the article for deletion page.
# When trying to delete a page, veteran editors love to use a lot of ]. Don't let these acronyms intimidate you.<br>Here is a list acronyms you can use yourself: ] which may support the page you created being kept.
# You can vote to ] into a larger or better established article on the same topic.


If your page is deleted, you still ]. Good luck! ] (]) 20:33, 14 January 2009 (UTC)
hi,


==Orphaned non-free media (File:Tao-te-ching005.png)==
I was reading something on help page. After few minutes i went to have coffe some body have deleted or edited the content in my help page and saved the page how can i get back that content. Please help me in doing this.
] Thanks for uploading ''']'''. The media description page currently specifies that it is non-free and may only be used on Misplaced Pages under a ]. However, it is currently ], meaning that it is not used in any articles on Misplaced Pages. If the media was previously in an article, please go to the article and see why it was removed. ] if you think that that will be useful. However, please note that media for which a replacement could be created are not acceptable for use on Misplaced Pages (see ]).
Thanks and regards, Y.Naganaresh {{unsigned|Naganaresh}}


If you have uploaded other unlicensed media, please check whether they're used in any articles or not. You can find a list of 'image' pages you have edited by clicking on the "]" link (it is located at the very top of any Misplaced Pages page when you are logged in), and then selecting "Image" from the dropdown box. Note that all non-free media not used in any '''articles''' will be deleted after seven days, as described on ]. Thank you.<!-- Template:Orphaned --> ] (]) 05:11, 29 January 2009 (UTC)
== Mean Red Spiders ==


==FfD to delete Time cover image==
All the information is true.
Hi. As you were the original uploader of ], used in ], I thought you might like to know a proceeding was brought to remove the Time image by outright deletion from the wiki . It's at http://en.wikipedia.org/Wikipedia:Files_for_deletion/2009_February_12#Time_evolution_wars.jpg .
If you are at all interested in the issue, it would be reasonable to post a "keep" or a "delete" at that page. ... ] (]) 14:49, 16 February 2009 (UTC)


David Humphreys {{unsigned|Dashumphreys}}


==Sorry to see you go and an appology==
==self published sources==


Dear Jossi,
"Material from self-published and questionable sources '''''may be used as sources in articles about themselves''''', so long as:


So sad to see you go! Whenever I would see your name enter a discussion, over and over again, I relaxed, here was a wikipedian with knowledge and fairness!
* it is relevant to their notability;
* it is not contentious;
* it is not unduly self-serving;
* it does not involve claims about third parties;
* it does not involve claims about events not directly related to the subject;
* there is no reasonable doubt as to who wrote it;
* the article is not based primarily on such sources."


stop removing sections without discussing them on the talk page. {{unsigned|71.61.208.156}}


I am also writing to apologize. When I read the register article, I accepted it as mostly accurate, without taking the time to really look at the facts and participated in the Prem Rawat arbitration, casting my voice against you.
: Exactly. Please do not re-add material that violates policy. ] <small>]</small>


I truly and deeply appologize for not trusting my experience with you and casting my opinion with a questionable source, and not taking the time to really investigate and form my own opinion.
==Thanks for Extension==


Dear Jossi,


Many thank for giving me (and everyone else out there) until the eighth to get the citations in.


Hope wiki-retirement is treating you well.


Warmly, ] (]) 16:49, 16 February 2009 (UTC)
== use of "alleged" and "allegations" ==


Jossi, hi. Hope you're doing well. I noticed your presence on the AfD apartheid-China article, and your effort to move it forward. This discussion reminded me about what you were explaining to me back in the cults in literature piece. Was your point was that "alleged" is a loaded term that already degrades the neutrality of the presentation? (That is, simply adding "allege" would't sufficiently help give a fair picture of the group/person.) If so, in what way would you apply that thinking to the disputed China article and its title? Thanks!! ] | ] 06:04, 5 August 2007 (UTC)


==File copyright problem with File:Vertical tabs sample.png==
: Hello HG. Yes, there is a similar problem here. I made a proposal to redirects all "Allegations of XXXX Apartheid" to the main article ], in which all countries about which such allegations have been made can be featured and main viewpoints summarized. A better name needs to be found as well, as an ArbCom member recently said, an article with "Allegation of" in its title is ''de facto'' forfeiting NPOV. Maybe something along the lines of "Controversial race relations", "Controversial race practices" or "Practices compared to apartheid" or the like. The problem is that in the current heated envireonment there is not much good will around to contemplate such an approach. Hopefully, after a cool-off period, editors may be interested in pursuing that or a similar path. ] <small>]</small> 07:24, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
]
Thank you for uploading ]. However, it currently is missing information on its copyright status. Misplaced Pages takes ] very seriously. It may be deleted soon, unless we can determine the '''license''' and the '''source''' of the file. If you know this information, then you can add a ''']''' to the ].


If you have uploaded other files, consider checking that you have specified their license and tagged them, too. You can find a list of files you have uploaded by following .
::Thanks for your reply. I'm not sure I could theoretically demonstrate the claim of the ArbCom member, but practically it's easy enough to suggest that a more neutral title may be coined. Sounds like we are quite close in thinking about this now, thanks again. ] | ] 23:32, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
::PS Your proposal/thinking is germane to ]. However, would you agree that any such collection of country allegations needs to be reliably sources as a synthesis per ]? This synthesis concern was raised with China. And your raised it maybe with the cults and culture article? If you feel like replying, how about on my Talk? Anyways, take care. ] | ] 00:37, 6 August 2007 (UTC)


If you have any questions, please feel free to ask them at the ]. Thanks again for your cooperation.<!-- Template:Di-no license-notice --> ▫ ''']''' 02:04, 23 March 2009 (UTC)
== Thank you ==
Jossi, thanks for the feedback. If you don't mind, if you feel a need to continue your debate with Ideogram, I would appreciate that it not be continued under my Note. I am concerned that it will distract people from the issues/q's raised by this Note, which I intend in good faith to be helpful to all. Also, you said "as long as you and others continue with not assuming the good faith of fellow editors...." I assume you are addressing G-Dett. Personally, I would ask that you <s>strikeout</s> this comment and, if need be, pursue it elsewhere. Otherwise, please make it clear in your text that you are accusing him and not me. Thanks again!! Pls reply to my talk if need be. ] | ] 02:43, 6 August 2007 (UTC)
: Will do. ] <small>]</small> 02:54, 6 August 2007 (UTC)
::Thanks for doing so. Regarding your other note, I need to decline further analysis of the Content due to my time constraints alone. Hope you don't mind. Regards. ] | ] 02:58, 6 August 2007 (UTC)


==]==
== I wanted to say thank you ==
This arbitration case has been closed and the final decision is available at the link above. {{User|Momento}} and {{User|Rumiton}} are banned from editing ] or any related article (including talk pages) for one year. The ] article and all related articles are subject to revert limitations for one year. Several users are admonished for their conduct in the case and all parties and other interested editors are encouraged to restart mediation in relation to ]. Also, should {{User|Jossi}} return to Misplaced Pages to edit Prem Rawat articles, he is required to contact the Arbitration Committee beforehand. These remedies are in addition to, and do not replace, the remedies passed in ].


For the Committee. ''']''' <sup>]</sup> 02:52, 20 April 2009 (UTC)
Thanx for cleaning up my page. I really appreciate that! I'm actually getting it again from the same guy on ]'s talk page. I ignore it (I don't engage the anonymous types), but he doesn't stop ranting on our pages. I appreciate you looking out for those of us who don't like to fight back. Thanx again. ] 02:52, 6 August 2007 (UTC)


''']'''
==Sockpuppet Investigation==


What do you think of ]? I am not yet an expert on sock puppets, but do you think this warrants CU? ] <sup>]</sup> 18:21, 6 August 2007 (UTC)
: Peculiar, indeed. But not enough to make that assumption IMO. ] <small>]</small> 18:54, 6 August 2007 (UTC)


==Proposed deletion of Unipaz==
== French apartheid ==
]
A ] template has been added to the article ], suggesting that it be deleted according to the proposed deletion process&#32; because of the following concern:
:<b>Notability-tagged since December, numerous unsourced statements</b>


All contributions are appreciated, but this article may not satisfy Misplaced Pages's ], and the deletion notice should explain why (see also "]" and ]). You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the <code>{{tl|dated prod}}</code> notice, but please explain why you disagree with the proposed deletion in your edit summary or on ].
I noticed your comment at ]. That exact same proposal is being discussed here if you would like to comment: ]. ] 21:17, 6 August 2007 (UTC)


Please consider improving the article to address the issues raised because, even though removing the deletion notice will prevent deletion through the ], the article may still be deleted if it matches any of the ] or it can be sent to ], where it may be deleted if ] to delete is reached.<!-- Template:PRODWarning --> &nbsp; <b>]&nbsp; ]&nbsp; </b> 21:57, 24 May 2009 (UTC)
== Thank you yet again, but.... ==


== Millennium '73 ==
he's already reverted your changes. Is this an edit war yet? Can he be temporarily stopped? I'd reply on the talk page, but I don't respond to anonymous users. I'm happy to post a response if asked by a known uesr or admin. Or, if you want, you can revert his changes and protect the page. I'm sorry to have to bother you. I DO appreciate the effort you're making. Thank you. ] 22:06, 6 August 2007 (UTC)
: I have given this user the last warning before a block. ] <small>]</small> 22:14, 6 August 2007 (UTC)
:: Thx again. I appreciate it.
::: I know you're probably sick of me by now, but it's still happening. After your two warnings, he's made a shi'ite load of edits, just trying to link Bill's page pack to his news blog, where he rips him. Instead of reverting though, he's re-adding, thus accomplishing the same thing. I'm tired of this. thanx for your help. ] 20:55, 7 August 2007 (UTC)


], to which you made significant contributions, has now been promoted to ] status. Thank you for your help. &nbsp; <b>]&nbsp; ]&nbsp; </b> 20:41, 27 May 2009 (UTC)
== Apology ==
I'm sorry for the way I spoke to you. --] 19:20, 7 August 2007 (UTC)
: OK. ] <small>]</small> 19:23, 7 August 2007 (UTC)


== ] ==
Why are you continuing to edit while ignoring my concerns? --] 01:54, 8 August 2007 (UTC)
: I have responded to each one of your concerns by taking your feedback and editing the article accordingly. If I missed anything please let me know in ta article's talk. ] <small>]</small>


::I have stated on the article's talk that you have not made any edits responding to my last twelve postings. --] 01:59, 8 August 2007 (UTC)
::: But I did. Check my edits. And if I missed anything, let me know. ] <small>]</small> 02:00, 8 August 2007 (UTC)
::::All of those twelve postings were made after your last edit at 18:05 so clearly you did not address them. Please read all postings with a timestamp of after 18:05 and either reply to them stating your objections or address them by editing the text. --] 02:03, 8 August 2007 (UTC)
::::: Responded. Please do no longer post here in regard of that article. That is what we have article's talk pages for. Thanks. ] <small>]</small> 05:27, 8 August 2007 (UTC)


This arbitration case has been closed and the final decision is available at the link above. The following editors are subjected to bans/topic-bans/restrictions as listed below :
== Your undo of a self-reversion on Landmark Talk page ==


*] : {{user|John254}} (Community Ban), {{user|Justallofthem}}
Hi Jossi
*Topic-banned : {{user|CSI LA}}, {{user|Grrrilla}}, {{user|Makoshack}}, {{user|Proximodiz}}, {{user|Su-Jada}}, {{user|TaborG}}, {{user|Jack Russell Terrier}}, {{user|Jpierreg}}, {{user|Maureen D}}, {{user|OngoingHow}}, {{user|Seelltey}}, {{user|Tturrisi}}, {{user|Voxpopulis}}, {{user|AndroidCat}}, {{user|Antaeus Feldspar}}, {{user|Anynobody}}, {{user|Derflipper}}, {{user|Fahrenheit451}}, {{user|Misou}}, {{user|Orsini}}, {{user|Shrampes}}, {{user|Shutterbug}}, {{user|Steve Dufour}}, {{user|Tilman}}, {{user|The Legendary Shadow!}}, {{user|Touretzky}}
*To contact the Committee : ]*, ]*, ]*, ]*, ]*, ]*, {{User|Rick Alan Ross}}
*Other restrictions :
**{{User|Jossi}} gave up his status as an administrator in the face of controversy concerning his administrator actions during an arbitration case, he may not be automatically re-granted adminship. However, he is free to seek readminship, should he choose to do so, at any time by a request for adminship at Requests for adminship.
**{{User|ChrisO}} is to abide to a binding voluntary restriction that within the Scientology topic (i) he limits his edits to directly improving articles to meet GA and FA criteria, using reliable sources; (ii) he makes no edits of whatever nature to biographies of living people; and (iii) he refrains from sysop action of whatever nature.
**{{User|Jayen466}} is topic-banned from articles about Rick Ross, broadly defined.


:<small>#Editors marked in * have since contacted the Committee.</small>
I noticed that you just reverted last night's edits by ]. Presumably this was because you saw it as a ''prima facie'' violation of the general policy not to remove content from talk pages?


Any editor who is subject to remedies in this proceeding, or who wishes to edit from an open proxy, is restricted to a single current or future account to edit Scientology-related topics and may not contribute to the topic as anonymous IP editors. Editors topic banned by remedies in this proceeding are prohibited (i) from editing articles related to Scientology or Scientologists, broadly defined, as well as the respective article talk pages and (ii) from participating in any Misplaced Pages process relating to those articles. Editors topic banned above may apply to have the topic ban lifted after demonstrating their commitment to the goals of Misplaced Pages and their ability to work constructively with other editors. Applications will be considered no earlier than six months after the close of this case, and additional reviews will be done no more frequently than every six months thereafter.
The background situation in this case is that new this user had been using this talk page (and a couple of others) as a blog to sound off about some personal dissatisfactions. After representations from other editors, he seems to have come to realise that this was inappropriate and was self-reverting his own material.


Any uninvolved administrator may, on his or her own discretion, ban any editor from editing within the Scientology topic. Prior to topic banning the editor, the administrator will leave a message on the editor's talk page, linking to this paragraph, warning the editor that a topic ban is contemplated and outlining the behaviours for which it is contemplated. If the editor fails to heed the warning, the editor may be topic banned, initially, for three months, then with additional topic bans increasing in duration to a maximum of one year. Any editor who, in the judgment of an uninvolved administrator, is (i) focused primarily on Scientology or Scientologists and (ii) clearly engaged in promoting an identifiable agenda may be topic-banned for up to one year.
Under the circumstances don't you think the deletion should stand? (alternatively, maybe it could be moved to an "off-topic archive", but that hardly seems necessary?). Regards. ] 10:10, 8 August 2007 (UTC)
::DaveApter, personally, I'm being responsible and dropping the issues because some of them are being addressed, and whatever the resolution, I understand policy is that on Wiki, one is not to do first person research. What I've gleaned, I'll talk about off-site. I'm going to attempt to revert back as at this point, what I wrote is not wiki policy, as you stated.] 10:21, 8 August 2007 (UTC)


All IP addresses owned or operated by the Church of Scientology and its associates, broadly interpreted, are to be blocked as if they were open proxies. Any current or future editor who, after this decision is announced, makes substantial edits to any Scientology-related articles or discussions on any page is directed to edit on these from only a single user account, which shall be the user's sole or main account, unless the user has previously sought and obtained permission from the Arbitration Committee to operate a legitimate second account. They shall edit in accordance to Misplaced Pages policies and refrain from advocacy, to disclose on the relevant talk pages any circumstances (but not including personal identifying information) that constitute or may reasonably be perceived as constituting a conflict of interest with respect to that page, and not through a proxy configuration.
:::Thanks Arcana, and I applaud your actions to clear this up. ] 10:43, 8 August 2007 (UTC)


- ''For the Arbitration Committee'', ] 01:31, 29 May 2009 (UTC)
You can simply archive that exchange rather than deleting it. ] <small>]</small> 15:28, 8 August 2007 (UTC)


== Protect free speech ==
==Destruction of 20 citations on Armstrong page==

Dear Jossi,
FYI,
An unknown editor has come in and has deleted 20 citations, and actually removed details in the references that directed readers and editors exactly where to look in the linked sources for the reference. Can I revert this? In our effort to resolve the controversy on the article and work out a consensus, it having a destabilizing effect (e.g. I reverted the whole thing tonight but that undid some good stuff someone else did to get a proper template for the citations). It's a little frustrating and just seems to be complicating things unnecessarily.] 05:15, 9 August 2007 (UTC)Jebbrady

: Hey Jebb. Look, I cannot babysit that article... Find some common ground with other involved editors, and if that is not happening, please pursue ]. I am willing to help here and there, but I am not on call... :) ] <small>]</small> 05:20, 9 August 2007 (UTC)
* http://en.wikipedia.org/User_talk:BullRangifer#Defend_free_speech
::Jossi, FYI, dispute resolution has now reached arbitration. Thank you for your help ] July 21 and 25. I filed a WQA on July 21 ] and I stepped away from the article myself July 31 to provide Jebbrady with the time he asked for to revise it (you had suggested a couple of weeks; he wanted "a month or better"). You had originally blocked one of his socks for vandalism in March which is described by ] in the July 21 SOCK report I filed ]. I filed a second SOCK report August 17 ]. The article in contention has now been submitted for arbitration by ] ]. -- ] | ] 05:48, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

-- ] (]) 08:03, 7 June 2009 (UTC)

== Thank you. ==
Your work will last for long time. ] is very simple, yet one of the more beautiful pages about the project. ]] 05:34, 10 June 2009 (UTC)

== Possibly unfree File:Condmilk.jpg ==
A file that you uploaded or altered, ], has been listed at ] because its copyright status is unclear or disputed. If the file's copyright status cannot be verified, it may be deleted. You may find more information on the ]. You are welcome to add comments to its entry at ] if you are interested in it not being deleted. Thank you. <!-- Template:Idw-pui --> ] (]) 04:10, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

== Documentation of sockpuppet investigation - where's the evidence? ==

Considering that this user retired back near the end of 2008 and never made any contributions after that, why is he/she indefinitely blocked as a "sockpuppet master"? Was the user allowed to defend itself? Why was no documentation provided? Note that I've opened up a thread about this here: ]. ] | (] - ]) 19:03, 27 June 2009 (UTC)

:I replied at that thread. --] (]) 19:12, 27 June 2009 (UTC)

:The use of an alternate account was an evasion of the remedy in ], and also had the effect of evading scrutiny, and so it was a violation of ]. &nbsp; <b>]&nbsp; ]&nbsp; </b> 02:35, 28 June 2009 (UTC)

::No evidence in that case was presented regarding lingering disputes. How far do we have to dig to get a straight answer here? Does this basically amount to "before you come back, check in with us so we can slap you on the wrist"? Jossi is getting banned for that kind of process wankery? You guys are better than this. -- ] 12:47, 28 June 2009 (UTC)

:::If you look at Pergamino's edits, you'll see that he was intentially deceptive about his knowledge of Misplaced Pages and his favorite topic. Further, Pergamino started editing while there was an active RFAR in which Jossi would have been a party if he hadn't "retired". So the use of the sock was not only deceptive, but it served to evade ArbCom sanctions. Regarding the sock investigation, checkuser results are never released, so that's nothing unusual. The ArbCom itself made the call, not just a functionary or admin. See the notes at ]. There's also evidence of past sockpppet use. &nbsp; <b>]&nbsp; ]&nbsp; </b> 18:27, 28 June 2009 (UTC)

::::If Jossi was thrown in as a party of the second arb case it would be very unlikely that any scansions on him would have been this severe. It's so easy to piss on good editors of the past and make them out to be villains, what with their deceptive and evil intentions. If I were to just speculate I would say that Jossi did this to avoid all the BS and get back to improving actual articles. It wouldn't excuse the violation of the arbcom case, sure, but it puts things into perspective. It sickens me to see editors treated like this. The taboo of the sockpuppet seems to trump all rational logic. -- ] 05:09, 29 June 2009 (UTC)

:::::Why would you speculate? All of Misplaced Pages administration is against Jossi now? He broke the rules, he got spanked like he knew he would if he got caught, where's the issue here? -- ] <small>]</sup></small> 05:18, 29 June 2009 (UTC)

::::::It's pretty startling that even now nobody can point me to a sockpuppet investigation page where a Checkuser publicly confirmed the evidence of sockpuppeting, with some diffs. Can you point me to the page? Why are you so against public evidence? ] | (] - ]) 05:37, 29 June 2009 (UTC)
:::::::Checkuser investigations are routinely done without posting an investigation, and in many SPIs the only feedback is "confirmed". I'm not sure what other evidence is required beyond checkuser, but I assume the ArbCom could be contacted directly with legitimate inquiries. &nbsp; <b>]&nbsp; ]&nbsp; </b> 05:52, 29 June 2009 (UTC)
::::::::In ], the first comment is by ] saying that he had checkusered the user, and then the Arcom clerk ] said that he had also seen some of the evidence and that he confirmed the basis for the block.
::::::::Also notice that the other sock ] said that he had communicated the identity of his main to an arbcom member, and that 8 hours later Arbcom member ] (bainer) declined his unblock request saying that it was not a legitimate usage of an alternative account. --] (]) 10:49, 29 June 2009 (UTC)

::::::::I suggest contacting them about what evidence they found and how convincing it was and why. --] (]) 09:55, 29 June 2009 (UTC)
:::::::::It seems likely that Jossi was using those sockpuppets inappropriately. But the problem is that the standard practice on Misplaced Pages is to use evidence which is not collected and organized systematicallym and sockpuppet ban templates which do not point to the evidence, so it's a huge hassle to find out when the sockpuppet verdict was a mistake, and only insiders know what happened. That's not sustainable, and it is a very cabal-like practice. ] | (] - ]) 17:50, 29 June 2009 (UTC)
:Simply put: No. Checkuser evidence is private to protect the privacy of everyone involved. Even if there ''were'' an SPI page opened, you'd have no more information than a {{tl|confirmed}} template on the page and a note acknowledging that the accounts were blocked: exactly what is available here. &mdash;&nbsp;]&nbsp;<sup>]</sup> 10:17, 29 June 2009 (UTC)
::Your underlying premise is that diffs and supporting evidence beyond a "Checkuser" confirmation are unnecessary, or that the public doesn't need to see this supporting evidence. Simply put: that's absurd. Plenty of people edit from the same locations in the same topics. Sockpuppet case investigation pages present the evidence (diffs), which are otherwise difficult to track down. They should be opened in any major case just to allow people to look for the evidence themselves. Also, the argument that this is to defend the accused's privacy seems weak. Sockpuppet investigation case pages do not violate the accused's privacy. The accused always benefits from some due process and transparency, as do we all. ] | (] - ]) 16:39, 29 June 2009 (UTC)
:::If you have a problem with the policy itself, then I would suggest that the correct place to have this discussion would be ] or ]. It would seem inappropriate to have this discussion on any user's talkpage unless there is something special about this user's ban. Are you posting on every user talkpage of confirmed sockpuppeteers? It would seem you haven't even attempted to discuss your views on checkuser confirmation on any policy pages yet, though that is the logical place to start. Also, you're assuming we only have the checkuser results to rely on, even though on the ] we have this, "CheckUser does not solve cases. It provides additional evidence of a technical nature that can be considered along with behavioral evidence, and may help clarify whether misuse has taken place". I would think that if you really wanted to improve this process you would do so from the policy pages where the involved admins already are, and not rely on whoever wanders past this page. -- ] <small>]</sup></small> 18:18, 29 June 2009 (UTC)
::::Did you miss the in the opening paragraph (])? I would prefer to discuss this in the policy area, but there were statements here that I wanted to respond to. See ]. ] | (] - ]) 19:07, 29 June 2009 (UTC)
:::::So we should cut and paste this *entire* discussion to the appropriate talk pages instead of cluttering up userspace, is that what you're recommending? Seems entirely appropriate to me too. Would you think ] or ] is best? Or possibly to one, with a note on the other linking it? -- ] <small>]</sup></small> 19:18, 29 June 2009 (UTC)
::::::I don't know about copy/pasting...the sockpuppet investigations (SPI) page is, I guess, a subpage of the sockpuppetry policy page, but the SPI page probably has a more traffic and therefore more people watching it. Right now it's sort of in Checkuser. I don't know how controversial this is. I dropped a notice over at ]. ] | (] - ]) 19:32, 29 June 2009 (UTC)
:::::::I'm not sure what the basis for this dispute is. Is there any doubt that Pergamino was a sock of Jossi's? Has Jossi denied it or complained about the process? I don't believe so. I think his silence is an implicit agreement with the finding. &nbsp; <b>]&nbsp; ]&nbsp; </b> 20:00, 29 June 2009 (UTC)
::::::::My impression is that retired users don't check their Misplaced Pages watchlist every couple days, or sometimes even at all. People move on with their lives. In the mess above there's some decent evidence that Pergamino was Jossi, but there's still no link to the initial request for Checkuser, what the basis was, ect. The link you provided (]) had '''zero evidence''' - it was circular (Jossi is banned because ). The most convincing evidence is from Enric, who said that one of the socks basically admitted to being Jossi in an email. ] | (] - ]) 21:25, 29 June 2009 (UTC)
:::::::::Note that mail was sent July last year and has nothing to do with more recent events. ''']]''' 23:32, 29 June 2009 (UTC)
CU evidence is private. Arbcom gets reports/requests/etc of all sorts everyday. If a CU is justified, an CU check will be run, as was the case here. These are called 'private CUs' and happen all the time. The requirement for a CU is that the evidence presented meet CU requirements. An SPI report may or may not be filed. It is place to collect most sock reports. Arbcom handles a lot of private matters and we can not, nor do we need to, file an SPI when we get a report/request. In this Jossi case at hand, we hand on wiki evidence, private correspondence, and a CU check. All together a very solid case for socking was shown, plus Jossi did not notify us as required by the arbcom ruling. I can post the onwiki public evidence here if someone is interested. <span style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif"> — ] • ] • </span> 20:45, 29 June 2009 (UTC)
:I think this is better discussed over at the thread I started or its subthread (]). The question is - why do these requests need to be private? Are there any rules which "the community" can read governing how these private discussions go? And why can't ArbCom file an SPI? But please don't answer these questions here. ] | (] - ]) 21:25, 29 June 2009 (UTC)

== 2012 Election Need Your Feedback ==

I noticed you were a regular editor on the 2008 election page. Myself and other editors are odds on some edits we are trying to make to the page. Since you have already been involved in probably similar discussion, we would greatly appreciate hearing your feedback on the 2012 election discussion page under the Republicans and Ruled Out discussions http://en.wikipedia.org/Talk:United_States_presidential_election,_2012#Republicans.3F

] (] • ]) 20:03, 4 August 2009 (UTC).

==Unreferenced BLPs==
] Hello Jossi! Thank you for your contributions. I am a ] alerting you that '''1''' of the articles that you created is tagged as an]. The ] policy requires that all personal or potentially controversial information be sourced. In addition, to ensure ], all biographies should be based on ]. If you were to bring this article up to standards, it would greatly help us with the current '']'' article backlog. Once the article is adequately referenced, please remove the {{tl|unreferencedBLP}} tag. Here is the article:

# ] - <small>{{findsources|Ajahn Jayasaro}}</small>
Thanks!--] (]) 22:17, 16 January 2010 (UTC)


==File permission problem with File:Anay disp detail.jpg==
]
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==] case==
{| align="left"
|| ]
|}
Your name has been mentioned in connection with a ] case. Please refer to ] for evidence. Please make sure you make yourself familiar with ] before editing the evidence page. ] ] (formerly known as ]). 20:23, 10 March 2010 (UTC)


== Congratulations ==


==File source problem with File:S t o x 22.jpg==
... on becoming an admin. And thanks for doing backlogged admin work, which is where I saw that you were one. And by the way, I really like the quote on your user page, ''"The problem with Misplaced Pages is that it only works in practice. In theory, it can never work."'' :-) --] 22:37, 9 August 2007 (UTC)
]
: I have been an admin since October 15, 2005... Thanks anyway. ] <small>]</small> 22:39, 9 August 2007 (UTC)
Thanks for uploading ''']'''. I noticed that the file's description page currently doesn't specify who created the content, so the ] status is unclear. If you did not create this file yourself, you will need to specify the owner of the copyright. If you obtained it from a website, please add a link to the website from which it was taken, together with a brief restatement of that website's terms of use of its content. However, if the copyright holder is a party unaffiliated from the website's publisher, that copyright should also be acknowledged.


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== Quick msg ==


Hi. I've enjoyed the ], which felt productive. Then it occurs to me that you've left it and maybe I'd said something inappropriate? Anyway, I wish there were a way of knowing in WP when such an exchange was ending. Thanks again for your good thinking and flexibility. ] | ] 04:57, 10 August 2007 (UTC) BTW, I've tried to offer supportive input on your proposal at Saudi Arabian allegations, in my own eccentric manner of course.
: No, I have not "left" and I think your proposals are excellent. I will continue engaging in the talk pages of these articles. Kol Tuv, ] <small>]</small> 14:37, 10 August 2007 (UTC)


==File source problem with File:In still2.jpg==
== Venkatavunnava ==
]
Thanks for uploading ''']'''. I noticed that the file's description page currently doesn't specify who created the content, so the ] status is unclear. If you did not create this file yourself, you will need to specify the owner of the copyright. If you obtained it from a website, please add a link to the website from which it was taken, together with a brief restatement of that website's terms of use of its content. However, if the copyright holder is a party unaffiliated from the website's publisher, that copyright should also be acknowledged.


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Hello Jossi, I've tried leaving messages on this editor's ] (as I also noticed you have done) but without any reply. Their ] are repeatedly obstructive, and show no sign of wanting to change the pattern. Is there any further action you would advise? Regards, ] 09:30, 10 August 2007 (UTC)
: If he/she persists we will have no choice than to block. Keep and eye on it and let me know. ] <small>]</small> 14:36, 10 August 2007 (UTC)


::The editing pattern has continued in the same vain. I have left a firmer warning message on their talk-page today. They may even be a sockpuppet of another user, as usually, even vandals would think of arguing on the talk page? ] 08:33, 12 August 2007 (UTC)


==File permission problem with File:Portrait by Jossi Fresco.jpg==
:::Unfortunately after repeated warnings the edits continue. See and . The editor has made no attempt to enter into any discussion, or seemingly to understand Misplaced Pages's policies? Regards, ] 13:16, 15 August 2007 (UTC)
]
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==] status==
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== Obama edits ==


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Hi Jossi - you may not be familiar with the case of {{user5|Dereks1x}}. I was not edit warring - I was reverting the edits by sockpuppets of this community banned user, restoring the text to where it was before he started this latest set of assaults, as were other editors. {{user5|Local667forOb}} has already been blocked for being a Dereks1x sock, and although checkuser was not successful for Oprahwasontv, his behavior, edit style, and the choice of edits he made - reverting all of Local667's edits with misleading comments on talk and in edit summary, and commenting in a particular way - make it clear that he is another one of Dereks1x's over 25 socks, and I believe he should be banned next. I can provide you with diffs if you like, but it's quite a lot of work digging through the edits and I think that people who are familiar with the case will see that it's the same person, apparently occasionally logging in from a different location as he has been known to do in the past under other aliases. One of us will probably have to write up another AN/I note about this latest one. Please see Bobblehead's comments . Jersyko has also worked extensively on this set of socks. Some of it is covered but there is a great deal more. I would appreciate not being blocked for following - please let me know if I can give you more information. <strong>] </strong>|<small>]</small> 21:10, 10 August 2007 (UTC)


If you have uploaded other files, consider checking that you have provided evidence that their copyright owners have agreed to license their works under the tags you supplied, too. You can find a list of files you have uploaded by following . '''Files lacking evidence of permission may be deleted one week after they have been tagged''', as described on ]. If you have any questions please ask them at the ]. Thank you.<!-- Template:Di-no permission-notice --><!-- Template:Db-csd-notice-custom --> ] (]) 16:21, 18 March 2010 (UTC)
== Barack Obama article ==


== File:Alfonsina y el Mar.jpg listed for deletion ==
There is no edit war going on at the Barack Obama article. The only thing going on is a banned user using multiple sockpuppets to continue a pattern of tendentious editing and disruption that got him banned and the proper application of ]. Your mischaracterization of what is going on as an edit war and content dispute is just a continuation of the disruption Dereks1x seems to enjoy. If you have a problem with ], take it up there and don't involve the Barack Obama article. Please return the article to it's previous semi-protection status and undo your changes to the talk page. Thanks. --] <sup>]</sup> 00:10, 11 August 2007 (UTC)
A file that you uploaded or altered, ], has been listed at ]. Please see the ] to see why this is (you may have to search for the title of the image to find its entry), if you are interested in it not being deleted. {{#if:|{{{2}}}|Thank you.}} <!-- Template:Fdw --> <span style="font-family:Trebuchet MS;">''']'''<sup><small>]</small></sup></span> 20:44, 17 April 2010 (UTC)
: I will respond in talk. ] <small>]</small> 02:44, 11 August 2007 (UTC)


== File:Still Life digital.jpg listed for deletion ==
== Deletion review note ==
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==File permission problem with File:Seth Godin.jpg==
]
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== Re Richard Rossi: Thank you... more help, please? ==


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I am a novice here at Misplaced Pages. Though I use it as a resource often, I've not edited before. And my first go at this with Rossi was pretty ham-handed. Please forgive my mistakes in addressing this entry -- but there's a problem. In fact, it may be dangerously fraudulent. I don't know enough about any of this to really do anything about that: no skills, no time, no clue. I'm just trying to get the newspaper-reported facts into the entry somehow.


==Fair use rationale for File:Casabella 471.jpg==
Why? It's a matter of principle.
]
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The Richard Rossi article came to my attention while I was researching evangelist Amy Semple McPherson, more or less on a lark. I surfed through the links, and found a YouTube clip of a no-budget movie about her, and clicked on it. Then followed a link (in the comments, I think) to learn that Rossi was in some kind of a competition... so I googled him, and wound up at Misplaced Pages... among other places.
:I copied the Fair Use Rationale from ]. --] (]) 19:25, 6 June 2010 (UTC)


==Orphaned non-free image File:Concierto aranjuez .jpg==
To say that Rossi has a checkered past is an understatement. I was stunned to see a vanity entry about him, adulatory in tone, when I had just read that he had been convicted of aggravated assault for beating his wife into a coma. The trial was sensational, much-covered by the local press. It made the wires, and because of the attempted murder happened shortly after OJ's Bronco ride, it was a cause celebre, in a small, very weird way. The newspaper accounts are really pretty good reading.
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It's dispiriting to see how his biographical entry has been abused to conceal his violent, criminal past. I was a real dummy to have marched into his entry, hacking the prose and overstating the case.


==MfD nomination of ]==
But the bottom line is that Rossi either deserves no biographical entry -- or it should focus on this episode of attempted murder/ aggravated assault... It's his only real claim to fame.
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== ] of ] ==
Please read the Talk section at Richard Rossi for all the details, painstakingly enumerated with links and publication dates.
]] has been nominated for deletion. You are invited to comment on the discussion at ]. Thank you.<!--Template:Tfdnotice--> ] 21:33, 9 January 2011 (UTC)


==Fair use rationale for File:Marzeah_Papyrus-hi.jpg==
Thanks for your attention. --] 04:42, 11 August 2007 (UTC)
]
: Thank you for your contributions. Have you taken some time to read our content policies? In particular read ], ] and ]. You may also want to read ]. If you have any questions about the nuances of these, please do not hesitate to ask. ] <small>]</small> 04:55, 11 August 2007 (UTC)
Thanks for uploading or contributing to ]. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under ] but there is no ] as to why its use in Misplaced Pages articles constitutes fair use. In addition to the ], you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use. Suggestions on how to do so can be found ].


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:: I've left him a talk-page note on the ] policy. Of course, ] should be adhered to, and, as I explained Achristiansoldier on my talk page, other editors who deleted material did nothing wrong, but Bernstein's conflict of interest should be recognized in future editing disputes on the page. I've rewritten the page to fully source and NPOV the controversial claims; can you spotcheck it to ensure that it complies with ]? Thanks. -- ] 08:12, 12 August 2007 (UTC)


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==]==
Hello,


==] nomination of ]==
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]
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On behalf of the Arbitration Committee,] 18:06, 12 August 2007 (UTC)
==Articleissues==
Hey Jossi, what do you think of the new proposed template design. I changed it around a bunch (i.e. made it so we didn't use a crappy template with a white background for everything), but I still think I like how the template was before anyone changed the design. Typical cleanup templates aren't meant to be hidden - which is exactly why they go on the main page rather than the talk page, and putting in a scroll box only makes them hidden and cluttered. But I'll let you have your own opinion--<small>]]</span></span></small> 00:28, 13 August 2007 (UTC)
: Thanks for the heads-up. I will reply at template's talk. ] <small>]</small> 00:32, 13 August 2007 (UTC)


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== File:Kaltura Logo.png listed for deletion ==
==Barack Obama==
A file that you uploaded or altered, ], has been listed at ]. Please see the ] to see why this is (you may have to search for the title of the image to find its entry), if you are interested in it not being deleted. Thank you. <!-- Template:Fdw --> ] (]) 18:02, 1 April 2012 (UTC)
The article need serious oversight. Could you mediate or do some other action to solve the incivility problem. As far as edit warring, there are only a few issues that need discussion, like if we should tell only half of the truth about his union endorsement, the Junior name, the Oprah part.
== File:Copperplate Gothic 29BC.png listed for deletion ==
A file that you uploaded or altered, ], has been listed at ]. Please see the ] to see why this is (you may have to search for the title of the image to find its entry), if you are interested in it not being deleted. Thank you. <!-- Template:Fdw --> ] <sup>]</sup> 04:13, 8 March 2013 (UTC)
== ] of ] ==
]] has been nominated for deletion. You are invited to comment on the discussion at ].<!--Template:Tfdnotice--> ] (]) 18:22, 14 March 2013 (UTC)


== Article notability notification ==
So far, most others have just revert, been hostile, and not explained. I have explained my rationale. It would be progress if a 3rd party like you could help. I am open minded but I can't deal with people who don't explain their reverts but simply yell "sock" in unison.] 02:16, 13 August 2007 (UTC)
: Just avoid editing directly. Make your comments in talk page and ask editors to address your arguments. ] <small>]</small> 02:23, 13 August 2007 (UTC)


] Hello. This message is to inform you that an article that you wrote, ], has been recently tagged with a notability notice. This means that it may not meet Misplaced Pages's ]. Please note that articles which do not meet these criteria may be ], ], or ]. Please consider adding ] to the article in order to establish the topic's notability. You may find the following links useful when searching for sources: {{find sources multi
Will the hostile editors stop editing directly and discuss? If so, I am willing to do this. What I am asking is if you can mediate/help or what ever word is appropriate. Leaving now will just make the situation worse. Thank you for your efforts.
|1 = Richard Regan
|2 =
|3 =
|4 =
|5 =


|introtext = ''Find sources:''&nbsp;
Normally I would think the issues in dispute are not that big but the hostility and incivility is mind boggling. ] 02:33, 13 August 2007 (UTC)
|introlink = g
: Just make your arguments clear, and if the arguments are solid and compelling, they may be listened to. It is not helping that you are making edits that are very similar to some editors that were banned for disruption. The burden is on you, I am afraid, to deonstrate that you are here in good faith and care about the aims of this project. ] <small>]</small> 02:36, 13 August 2007 (UTC)
|introseparator = &nbsp;–&nbsp;
::Except that he is not. His response was Check the history, Jossi. It's the identical pattern. <strong>] </strong>|<small>]</small> 20:11, 16 August 2007 (UTC)


|link1 = gnews
== thanks for the comment ==
|display1 = {{#if: | free news | news }}
|link2 = gbooks
|display2 = books
|link3 = gscholar
|display3 = scholar
|link4 = jstor
|display4 = JSTOR
|link5 = gfreeimages
|display5 = free images


|free =
sorry about that I removed the rant and put up a proper dispute resolution thingy I was frustrated and went too far :) ] 06:35, 13 August 2007 (UTC)


== Talk:List of unrecognized countries‎ ==


}}. Thank you for editing Misplaced Pages! <!-- NOVOXEL:{{{1}}} --> ] 22:37, 24 May 2013 (UTC)
On the talk page of the article "List of unrecognized countries‎", a user with various IP addresses and a new user account called JUSTICE FOREVER has placed a lot of off-topic material that seems to me to be in breach of all POV policies. Could I ask you as a random admin to take a look (at http://en.wikipedia.org/Talk:List_of_unrecognized_countries#Turkish_Republic_of_Northern_Cyprus) and see whether it would be permissible to delete some of these comments, which seem to me to be quite offensive and not necessary to the topic? It needs someone coolheaded and uninvolved to deal with, if possible, as I fully admit that I'm not impartial myself. Cheers ] 08:40, 13 August 2007 (UTC)


== An RfC that you ''may'' be interested in... ==
== XXX apartheid ==


As one of the previous contributors to {{Tl|Infobox film}} or as one of the commenters on it's talk page, I would like to inform you that there has been a ] started on the talk page as to ]. Your comments and thoughts on the matter would be welcomed. Happy editing!
Hi Jossi,<br/>
: <small>This message was sent by ] (]) on behalf of <span class="nowrap">&#123;&#123;U&#124;]&#125;&#125;</span> <sup>(] • ] • ])</sup> 18:27, 8 March 2014 (UTC)</small>
I think we never met before on wp:en.<br/>
<!-- Message sent by User:Technical 13@enwiki using the list at http://en.wikipedia.org/search/?title=Template:Infobox_film/list&oldid=598721132 -->
I left the debate about israeli apartheid before you joined it ;-)<br/>
Long and hard topic.<br/>
I have read some of your comments on the talk page and I think we are on the same wavelength concerning all this.<br/>
I hope the ArbCom will agree to analyse the ''content'' issue at least as ''context'' of the dispute but I am quite sure it will not as it was ready not to accept the case.<br/>
Good luck anyway !<br/>
] 10:26, 14 August 2007 (UTC)


== Proposed deletion of Rob Preece ==
Hi again,<br/>
]
And I think we can say we are not exactly the same : (excerpt from my former user page)


The article ] has been ]&#32; because of the following concern:
---
:'''Easily even speedy and PROD material as my searches found nothing better than some passing mentions, and otherwise unusable for notability, at News, Books and browsers.'''
Whatever this could mean here are the results of the test about our "world's view" I performed several times :


While all constructive contributions to Misplaced Pages are appreciated, content or articles may be ].
existentialist : 85-100%
materialist : 90-95%
modernist : 80-90%
post-modernist : 70-75%
cultural creative : 40-50%
fondamentalist : ~20%
romanticist : 0-20%
idealist : 0-20%


You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the {{Tlc|proposed deletion/dated}} notice, but please explain why in your ] or on ].
I think I am more romanticist and idealist than what the test concludes.
---
] 16:21, 14 August 2007 (UTC)


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==Citing sources==
== File:Skeleton diag.png listed for discussion ==
Would you mind taking a quick look at ]. It seems to be a fairly significant change to the guideline that went unnoticed for almost two months...and I think it's important enough to put back in, even while the article is being protected. Unless there was a consensus that I'm missing on it's removal. Thanks! ] <small>]</small> 19:15, 14 August 2007 (UTC)
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==File permission problem with File:Dr James T. Richardson.JPG==
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Hello !


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{{u|6SJ7}} alleges that you may have voted "oppose if the merge is only applied to the French article, merge if all articles are merged" as him, and uses that point to say that there was no consensus. Can you please state if you do support the merge proposal of the French article alone or not ?


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Please answer on ''my'' talk page (:
== Nomination for deletion of Template:Protection msg ==
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== ] of ] ==
]


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Thanks !
<blockquote>orphaned image, no encyclopedic use</blockquote>


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] <font color="red">]</font> 20:32, 14 August 2007 (UTC)
: I will stay out of this one... But I do not disagree on merging these articles, if involved editors consider it the best way to move forward. ] <small>]</small> 20:34, 14 August 2007 (UTC)


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== ] ==


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You tagged this article recently, please explain what the issue is on the article talk page. Tags without accompanying explanation on the talk page are no help and will be removed. ] 00:45, 15 August 2007 (UTC)
: It is self explanatory: unreferenced material, and original research. I commented in talk, if that would help. ] <small>]</small> 01:43, 15 August 2007 (UTC)
::Thanks. Can you place inline "cite" tags against those assertions you believe to be unreferenced. ] 01:55, 15 August 2007 (UTC)
::: Sure. ] <small>]</small> 02:14, 15 August 2007 (UTC)


<span style="color:red;font-weight:bold;">This bot DID NOT nominate any file(s) for deletion; please refer to the ] of each individual file for details.</span> Thanks, ] (]) 01:00, 9 April 2020 (UTC)
== Help for discussing ==


== ] of ] ==
Hi,<br/>
]
Would you agree helping me in discussing the neutralisation of both these articles : ] with ] and ] with ] ?<br/>
] 07:03, 15 August 2007 (UTC)


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== RE: article:http://en.wikipedia.org/John_W._Morgan ==
<blockquote>'''Orphaned file with no obvious value in transferring to Commons'''</blockquote>


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Hello Jossi,


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I see that the last time the IP editing ban was placed on this article it was you who put it there. I was wondering if you could do that again. Three ips within 36 hours have tried to start the same editting war that was in place two months ago.


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Thank you for any help you can provide.
-] 23:34, 17 August 2007 (UTC)


== ] of ] ==
== RE: Categories ==
]


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== Categories ==
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Hi Jossi, there is actually a WikiProject called Dravidian civlizations. That is why I have created the Category:Dravidian civilizations and to put everything in sub-categories under that title. Sub-categories would be ''Dravidian people'', ''Dravidian architecture'', etc. Please let me know what you think. Regards. ] 04:55, 18 August 2007 (UTC)
: I see, thanks for the heads up. ] <small>]</small> 04:58, 18 August 2007 (UTC)


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== First draft ==


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I've completed ] regarding the first/second class distinction idea. Take a look over it and leave some thoughts if you would. ], if you have some ideas. Cheers! ] 08:41, 19 August 2007 (UTC)


== ] of ] ==
: I surely take a look and see if I can improve upon your brilliant prose! ] <small>]</small> 14:21, 19 August 2007 (UTC)
]


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== I could use your help if you have time ==
<blockquote>'''Orphaned file with no obvious value in transferring to Commons'''</blockquote>


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When you have a chance, could you look at ], especially the lengthy discussion (you ought to read the whole thing, although the most salient points are toward the end)? I am especially concerned with Fourdee. The underlying issue is whether races (in this case, obviously, the white race) are biologically real or social constructions. I feel very confident in my grasp of both the sociological and genetic research and know that Fourdee is wrong, but I have tried very hard not to engage him on this. Instead, I have tried, consistently, to make the discussion about compliance with our core policies. Fourdee has been (in my opinion) consistently courteous. But I believe he is a racist, and it seems obvious to me (and my question is, will it be obvious to you too as you read through the discussion, and slowly see slight changes in his position/rationale) tht he is nothing more than a POV pusher who wishes to use Misplaced Pages articles as his own soap-box. I do not know if the situation is appropriate for an RfC. But I would (1) like to know whether you think my reading of him is right, or whether I am over-reacting, and (2) if you do think I am right, I would appreciate whatever support you consider appropriate. Thanks, ] | ] 11:01, 19 August 2007 (UTC)


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: Will do. ] <small>]</small> 14:21, 19 August 2007 (UTC)
: Obviously a person that believes on certain racists ideas, that slowly emerge as the arguments progresses. I will weigh in if I see that I can contribute, but I think you and others are doing quite well already. ] <small>]</small> 14:42, 19 August 2007 (UTC)


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== Would appreciate your opinion on this ==


== ] of ] ==
Hi, Jossi. I'd like the opinion of a Misplaced Pages veteran like yourself on this decision I just made to delete some material. Thanks! ] 11:46, 19 August 2007 (UTC)
]
: Granted, it is a bit of trivia. But it is harmless. Many articles have a "In popular culture" sections. ] <small>]</small> 14:23, 19 August 2007 (UTC)


The file ] has been ]&#32;because of the following concern:
Okay, thanks. Will restore. ] 14:57, 19 August 2007 (UTC)
<blockquote>'''Orphaned file with no obvious value in transferring to Commons'''</blockquote>


While all constructive contributions to Misplaced Pages are appreciated, pages may be ].
== Hello there ==


You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the {{Tlc|proposed deletion/dated files}} notice, but please explain why in your ] or on ].
First, I'd like to apologize to you for a certain heated exchange we had some weeks back at UCFD. I sometimes get passionate about stuff, and I overdid it. That being said, I'd like to caution you about the POV-pushers on the ] article, as trhey are very good at baiting people into a revert war and using inappropriate warning templates (and getting away with it too!). I'm thinking this may need to be escalated beyond mere MedCab into something else (looks like Medcab will be turned down by them anyway), but I'm not sure what the next step should be. In any case, I'm loath to let them undo a day's work by nearly a dozen editors, but I'm nearing my 3RR limit myself, and I don't want to be accused of "gaming the system" by cutting it too close (what was done to Muntuwandi). In any case, your help on the article is appreciated.--] 23:13, 19 August 2007 (UTC)


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== ] of ] ==
==Talk?==
]


The file ] has been ]&#32;because of the following concern:
Hi Jossi,
<blockquote>'''Orphaned file with no obvious value in transferring to Commons'''</blockquote>


While all constructive contributions to Misplaced Pages are appreciated, pages may be ].
I'm just wondering if you could talk to ]. He's been edit warring along with Antelan on the ] and other articles, and being uncivil. Following me around. I warned him and got response. These aren't all the diffs, I think he was uncivil on the talk page a few more times. All they do, along with the summaries, is give a flavor:


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== ] of ] ==
]


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<blockquote>'''Redundant to the individual images on the Rider-Waite tarot deck'''</blockquote>


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== ] of ] ==
]


The file ] has been ]&#32;because of the following concern:
<small>—The preceding ] comment was added by ] (] • ]){{#if:05:37, August 20, 2007 (UTC)|&#32;05:37, August 20, 2007 (UTC)}}.</small><!-- Template:Unsigned --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->
<blockquote>'''Orphaned file with no obvious value in transferring to Commons'''</blockquote>


While all constructive contributions to Misplaced Pages are appreciated, pages may be ].
Come to think of it, your opinion in that article would be appreciated. Here is the currnet lead:


You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the {{Tlc|proposed deletion/dated files}} notice, but please explain why in your ] or on ].
Psychic surgery is a phenomenon that originated in the 20th Century and has been deemed a form of medical fraud. During psychic surgery, practitioners appear to perform painless surgery using their fingers and unsterile tools. They say that they extract "tumors" or other pathological masses such as pus or bones from the patient's body through an incision. Psychic surgery is most prevalent in its countries of origin: Brazil and the Philippines.


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Psychic surgery has been denounced by the US Federal Trade Commission as a "total hoax", and the American Cancer Society maintains that psychic surgery may cause needless death by keeping the ill away from life-saving medical care. Professional skeptics say that such paranormal talents do not exist, and argue that sleight of hand can best explain psychic surgery.
== "Aspirare" listed at ] ==
]
A discussion is taking place to address the redirect ]. The discussion will occur at ] until a consensus is reached, and anyone, including you, is welcome to contribute to the discussion. <!-- from Template:RFDNote --> (] &#183; ]) ''']''' 22:56, 2 May 2021 (UTC)


== ]: Contentious topic designation removed ==
I kinda think we should define first. Then blast it (; &ndash;&ndash;&ndash;''']''' <sub>(] Ψ ])</sub> 05:28, 20 August 2007 (UTC)


Hello {{u|Jossi}},
== User inquiry ==


As a very late update to the ] arbitration case, the ] designation, previously "discretionary sanctions", originally "article probation", has been removed following a successful
Since we don't really share POV etc on ], I thought I would ask you about ], because I am increasingly concerned he is just trolling.


Any actions previously taken in accordance with the contentious topic designation remain in force and are governed by the ].
For example, after I reverted some reformatting he did to the talk page, with a nice, civil explanation, he just went around and accused me of ].


This notification may be mostly unnecessary, but as you had been a party to the original case, I thought you might be interested in hearing that after about 15 years, this remnant has been removed. Until today, it was listed at {{slink|Misplaced Pages:General_sanctions#Arbitration_Committee-authorised_sanctions}}.
Am I over reacting? Or is he not being productive? I am specially worried because he put about two days ago in his talk page a message saying "This editor will not contribute any more to wikipedia." but he continues to intervene in talk pages and in some cases articles. I do not think he is being productive, regardless of POV. What do you think? Thanks!--] 07:28, 20 August 2007 (UTC)


Best regards,<br>] (]) 19:37, 10 October 2023 (UTC)
:Cerejota,
:let's forget your personal attacks.
:concerning my talk page, it is true I am a little bit fed-up by wp, particularly wp:en.
:But about my neutrality and productivity, just read this article and the talk page that goes with it :
:]
:Until yesterday evening, any single information in that article was from me and wikipedia can benefit of this thanks to the support of ] who translated this.
:Thank to this, half of the article concerning the ] is not a battlefield anymore and thanks to this, good editors come back and work on it (I mean, people who knows about the topic and who have books written by scholars concerning this).
:We are currently working on the translation of ] (again for which I am the main contributor), which is a featured article on wp:fr but pov-disputed here.
:So, please, don't come and talk about "productivity" with such sentences such as : "I do not think he is being productive, regardless of POV"; I think he is trolling.
:] 08:33, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

Latest revision as of 19:37, 10 October 2023

This account has been blocked indefinitely because CheckUser evidence confirms that the account's owner has abusively used multiple accounts.

(Account information: block log · CentralAuth · suspected sockpuppets · confirmed sockpuppets · sockpuppet investigations casepage)

There are at least two kinds of games.

One could be called finite, the other infinite.

The finite game is played for the purpose of winning, and thereby ending the game.

An infinite game for the purpose of continuing the play ... and bringing as many persons as possible into the play.

Finite players play within boundaries; infinite players play with boundaries.

Finite players are serious; infinite games are playful.

Finite players try to control the game, predict everything that will happen, and set the outcome in advance. They are serious and determined about getting that outcome. They try to fix the future based on the past.

Infinite players enjoy being surprised. Continuously running into something they didn't know will ensure that the game will go on. The meaning of the past changes depending on what happens in the future.

All games are inherently voluntary. There might be consequences of not playing, but there is always a choice required. There are certain rules and boundaries that appear to be externally defined, and you choose to follow them or not. If you stop following them you aren't playing the game any longer.

There is no rule that says you have to follow the rules, and there is no rule that says you have to play. If you have to play, you cannot really play.

All finite games have rules. If you follow the rules you are playing the game. If you don't follow the rules you aren't playing.

Infinite players play with rules and boundaries. They aren't taking them serious, and they can never be trapped by them, because they use rules and boundaries as part of their playing.

Players can do what they do seriously, because they must do it, because they must survive to the end, and are afraid of the consequences of not playing or not winning. Or, players can do everything they do playfully, always knowing they have a choice, having no need to survive the way they are, allowing every element of the play to transform them, taking pleasure in every surprise they meet. Those are the differences between finite and infinite players.

You can play finite games within an infinite game. You can not play infinite games within a finite game.

There is only but one infinite game.

Paraphrased from James P. Carse, Finite and infinite games: A Vision of Life in Play and Possibility

≈ jossi ≈ (talk)



Very sorry to see you leave, Jossi. I fully respect your decision to retire, but do know that I would be very happy to see you make a return to actively contributing at some point.
My very best, AGK 10:14, 22 December 2008 (UTC)

As would I. I disagreed with some of your decisions, but think you have much to offer the community and the Project. Don't let some sour grapes disinterest you - make grappa! :) - Arcayne () 15:30, 23 December 2008 (UTC)
I am sorry to see you leave the project; you were a valuable asset to this community. Best wishes, seicer | talk | contribs 00:14, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
Your actions were benevolent, reasoned and always truthful, in my mind; it is a surprise that you departed so suddenly. It is a real shame you have left. Good luck. Caulde 00:19, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
(As above, please move or remove this message at your discretion if you don't want it here.) I can't say we always got along, but I certainly always was glad to see you in a difficult situation. Best of luck to you, wherever that great infinite game takes you. Seraphimblade 03:10, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
I am very sorry to see you go. When I was a newbie you were extraordinarily kind and patient with me and I greatly appreciated it. Best of luck to you! Renee (talk) 13:08, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

Sorry, I'm a bit thick sometimes. So, hum, real life is the only infinite game, wikipedia is a finite game. Since wikipedia is a finite game, at some point in wikipedia's game you stop running into surprising stuff that you didn't know about, and players wind up being being trapped by wikipedia's rules, being afraid of consequences of not "winning", etc. Text between lines: wikipedia ougth to be an infinite game, but it's not. Did I get it right? --Enric Naval (talk) 14:06, 29 December 2008 (UTC)

Close, Enric ...
Look at it this way, collaboration is the antithesis of winning. Players in a game can be focused in terminating the game by winning or by declaring once side as the loser. In collaboration, all players are focused intently in keeping the game going.
Misplaced Pages is indeed a finite game, but has embodied many traits of an infinite game. For example , there is WP:IAR: If a rule prevents you from improving or maintaining Misplaced Pages, ignore it., i.e. if a rule prevents the game to continue, ignore it. The challenge is, thought, as Misplaced Pages grows in importance, authority, and reach, it's basic principles of collegial collaboration, civility, anybody can edit, free content, and neutral point of view (WP:FIVE) are being challenged by more traditional forces, which I would call routinization. This routinization is visible in the quite large body of policies, guidelines, manuals of style, etc. that has developed as well as the processes developed to keep the game going: Arbitration, Administrators, Page protection, Bans, Blocks etc. (Note that I am not judging that to be good or bad, simply stating a fact: after all I was quite involved in these aspects myself. )
As soon as these routinizing aspects begin consuming too many resources — and in WP the only resource is volunteer time (besides $$ needed to run the servers and keep a small staff) — the purpose of the game begin to be lost: Rather than build new articles, improve new ones, expand the number of players, encourage participation, etc. the most experienced people and those with most time, tend to spend their wiki-time in areas that limit play. I am not arguing that these tasks are not needed; they are. Only that over time, the fundamental principles of Misplaced Pages get lost or constrained in such a manner that it impinges in these principles and may eventually lead to terminating play. As an editor that invested quite a bit of time in that area, I am aware of the dichotomy it presents and the challenges in bridging it.
Another challenge is when players try to bring about other games into Misplaced Pages than Wikpiedia's own. Players try and transpose the games they have chosen to play IRL, into this project. That is why we have WP:BATTLE, the other side of WP:WRW. Just witness the ongoing political, scientific, religious, and other such disputes that have been developing over the last years (check WP:RFAR/C for a good sample), and the many efforts by the community to overcome these challenges. A notable point is that in almost every arbitration case (with some notable exceptions), the result is the imposition of restrictions to participate fully in the game ... "in order to continue playing, you are now restricted from playing", an obvious contradiction.
So, as long as there are editors that will do everything possible to keep the game going, and do that with such grace and diligence that does not result in restricting play, Misplaced Pages may have a chance. But if these editors that are intent in winning the game at the expense of keeping the playing going, become those that steer the project forward, then it may not. My opinion is that Misplaced Pages is at that cross-road. The new Arbitration committee, which IMO has more diversity than ever before, as well as having people that I admire for the brilliance of their minds and the generosity of their hearts, may be the ones tasked to see this through, that is if they managed to bring the community around to support their efforts when exploring these challenges.
Per Carse, it boils down to choice If you have to play, you cannot play. It seems that those that want to win the game, are usually those that feel compelled to play it, and are those that play it too seriously for their own good. And those that want to keep the game going are usually those that edit with a smile on they face, enjoying the game, bringing new players to the game and expanding the possibility of play.
So, my decision to retire is based on that choice: because I can. I said this without judgment of other players: I wish them wisdom in their own choices, playfulness in their play, and my best.
Happy New Year,
≈ jossi ≈ (talk) 18:24, 29 December 2008 (UTC)
Well, I'm happy that you are not retiring because of bitterness. Myself, I'm staying if only because I can't resist seeing all the process first hand , you know, watching train crashes in slow motion :) I don't understand everything that you say, but I'll take your comments and try to be more playful on my editing. --Enric Naval (talk) 21:28, 25 January 2009 (UTC)
Although I'm only seeing your edits now after you have left I'm also sorry to see you go and hope you reconsider in due course. You may be happy to know that I'm making some progress with COI reform (one small step at a time), for example WP:NPA and WP:WHYCOI. Perhaps you would consider helping out with such things, if not involving yourself in editing as such. In particular you and I share the view of volunteer time being a precious resource while 1's and 0's are a commodity, and I hope to "leverage" my contributions by trimming back some of the areas where time is wasted (e.g. 50k AfDs over 5k articles). Would you consider helping me write an essay on "respect for human time" or similar? -- samj in 13:17, 10 March 2009 (UTC)

Seasons Greetings

Wishing you the very best for the season. Guettarda (talk) 00:07, 25 December 2008 (UTC)

Vaya con Dios

Hasta luego, amigo. If I may be so bold, I hope that you made your decision to leave for the sake of your own spiritual health and not in the hopes of influencing Misplaced Pages. Because even a token participation here on your part would be infinitely more helpful than leaving. But if you left because you felt that continued participation was not in the best interests of your continued spiritual growth then I am with you, brother. I will hang in, though. Best Holiday Wishes. --Justallofthem (talk) 18:31, 28 December 2008 (UTC)

--Take care dude, don't neglect your video games and remember to have crazy fun on the weekends. tilda tilda tilda tilda —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mortello (talkcontribs) 07:32, 5 January 2009 (UTC)

Admin templates on userpage

Hello, I have removed your admin templates on your userpage as you are not an administrator. I noticed your retirement message - perhaps you just forgot to remove them before leaving. Any queries, please don't hesitate to contact me. :) neuro 00:44, 31 December 2008 (UTC)

An olive branch

Peace
Best wishes for the New Year.   Will Beback  talk  18:41, 31 December 2008 (UTC)

Best wishes

I'm sorry to see that your positive experiences with Misplaced Pages were overtaken by negative ones. I too am very sorry to see you leave. Perhaps time away will allow you to come to terms with how things turned out. If that itch to contribute to Misplaced Pages ever comes back, a good way to regain your joy of contribution might be to look over your earliest contributions and follow along the path to where you realized that this is where you wanted to be. Best wishes. -- Suntag 16:27, 2 January 2009 (UTC)

An article you created maybe deleted soon: Tools which can help you

The article you created: Digital artist may be deleted from Misplaced Pages.

There is an ongoing debate about whether your article should be deleted here:

The faster you respond, the better chance the article you created can be saved.

Finding sources which mention the topic of your article is the very best way to avoid an article being deleted {{Findsources3}}:

Find sources for Digital artist : google news recent, google news old, google books, google scholar, NYT recent, NYT old, a9, msbooks, msacademic ...You can then cite these results in the Article for deletion discussion.

Also, there are several tools and helpful editors on Misplaced Pages who can help you:

  1. List the page up for deletion on Article Rescue Squadron. You can get help listing your page on the Article Rescue Squadron talk page.
  2. You can request a mentor to help explain all of the complex rules that editors use to get a page deleted: Misplaced Pages:Adopt-a-User. But don't wait for a mentor to respond to you before responding on the article for deletion page.
  3. When trying to delete a page, veteran editors love to use a lot of rule acronyms. Don't let these acronyms intimidate you.
    Here is a list acronyms you can use yourself: WP:Deletion debate acronyms which may support the page you created being kept.
  4. You can vote to merge the article into a larger or better established article on the same topic.

If your page is deleted, you still have many options available. Good luck! travb (talk) 20:33, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

Orphaned non-free media (File:Tao-te-ching005.png)

Thanks for uploading File:Tao-te-ching005.png. The media description page currently specifies that it is non-free and may only be used on Misplaced Pages under a claim of fair use. However, it is currently orphaned, meaning that it is not used in any articles on Misplaced Pages. If the media was previously in an article, please go to the article and see why it was removed. You may add it back if you think that that will be useful. However, please note that media for which a replacement could be created are not acceptable for use on Misplaced Pages (see our policy for non-free media).

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FfD to delete Time cover image

Hi. As you were the original uploader of Image:Time_evolution_wars.jpg, used in Intelligent design, I thought you might like to know a proceeding was brought to remove the Time image by outright deletion from the wiki . It's at http://en.wikipedia.org/Wikipedia:Files_for_deletion/2009_February_12#Time_evolution_wars.jpg . If you are at all interested in the issue, it would be reasonable to post a "keep" or a "delete" at that page. ... Kenosis (talk) 14:49, 16 February 2009 (UTC)


Sorry to see you go and an appology

Dear Jossi,

So sad to see you go! Whenever I would see your name enter a discussion, over and over again, I relaxed, here was a wikipedian with knowledge and fairness!


I am also writing to apologize. When I read the register article, I accepted it as mostly accurate, without taking the time to really look at the facts and participated in the Prem Rawat arbitration, casting my voice against you.

I truly and deeply appologize for not trusting my experience with you and casting my opinion with a questionable source, and not taking the time to really investigate and form my own opinion.


Hope wiki-retirement is treating you well.

Warmly, Hohohahaha (talk) 16:49, 16 February 2009 (UTC)


File copyright problem with File:Vertical tabs sample.png

File Copyright problem
File Copyright problem

Thank you for uploading File:Vertical tabs sample.png. However, it currently is missing information on its copyright status. Misplaced Pages takes copyright very seriously. It may be deleted soon, unless we can determine the license and the source of the file. If you know this information, then you can add a copyright tag to the image description page.

If you have uploaded other files, consider checking that you have specified their license and tagged them, too. You can find a list of files you have uploaded by following this link.

If you have any questions, please feel free to ask them at the media copyright questions page. Thanks again for your cooperation. ▫ JohnnyMrNinja 02:04, 23 March 2009 (UTC)

RFAR/Prem Rawat 2

This arbitration case has been closed and the final decision is available at the link above. Momento (talk · contribs) and Rumiton (talk · contribs) are banned from editing Prem Rawat or any related article (including talk pages) for one year. The Prem Rawat article and all related articles are subject to revert limitations for one year. Several users are admonished for their conduct in the case and all parties and other interested editors are encouraged to restart mediation in relation to Prem Rawat. Also, should Jossi (talk · contribs) return to Misplaced Pages to edit Prem Rawat articles, he is required to contact the Arbitration Committee beforehand. These remedies are in addition to, and do not replace, the remedies passed in RFAR/Prem Rawat.

For the Committee. MBisanz 02:52, 20 April 2009 (UTC)

Discuss this


Proposed deletion of Unipaz

A proposed deletion template has been added to the article Unipaz, suggesting that it be deleted according to the proposed deletion process because of the following concern:

Notability-tagged since December, numerous unsourced statements

All contributions are appreciated, but this article may not satisfy Misplaced Pages's criteria for inclusion, and the deletion notice should explain why (see also "What Misplaced Pages is not" and Misplaced Pages's deletion policy). You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the {{dated prod}} notice, but please explain why you disagree with the proposed deletion in your edit summary or on its talk page.

Please consider improving the article to address the issues raised because, even though removing the deletion notice will prevent deletion through the proposed deletion process, the article may still be deleted if it matches any of the speedy deletion criteria or it can be sent to Articles for Deletion, where it may be deleted if consensus to delete is reached.   Will Beback  talk  21:57, 24 May 2009 (UTC)

Millennium '73

Millennium '73, to which you made significant contributions, has now been promoted to WP:Featured article status. Thank you for your help.   Will Beback  talk  20:41, 27 May 2009 (UTC)

Misplaced Pages:Requests for arbitration/Scientology

This arbitration case has been closed and the final decision is available at the link above. The following editors are subjected to bans/topic-bans/restrictions as listed below :

#Editors marked in * have since contacted the Committee.

Any editor who is subject to remedies in this proceeding, or who wishes to edit from an open proxy, is restricted to a single current or future account to edit Scientology-related topics and may not contribute to the topic as anonymous IP editors. Editors topic banned by remedies in this proceeding are prohibited (i) from editing articles related to Scientology or Scientologists, broadly defined, as well as the respective article talk pages and (ii) from participating in any Misplaced Pages process relating to those articles. Editors topic banned above may apply to have the topic ban lifted after demonstrating their commitment to the goals of Misplaced Pages and their ability to work constructively with other editors. Applications will be considered no earlier than six months after the close of this case, and additional reviews will be done no more frequently than every six months thereafter.

Any uninvolved administrator may, on his or her own discretion, ban any editor from editing within the Scientology topic. Prior to topic banning the editor, the administrator will leave a message on the editor's talk page, linking to this paragraph, warning the editor that a topic ban is contemplated and outlining the behaviours for which it is contemplated. If the editor fails to heed the warning, the editor may be topic banned, initially, for three months, then with additional topic bans increasing in duration to a maximum of one year. Any editor who, in the judgment of an uninvolved administrator, is (i) focused primarily on Scientology or Scientologists and (ii) clearly engaged in promoting an identifiable agenda may be topic-banned for up to one year.

All IP addresses owned or operated by the Church of Scientology and its associates, broadly interpreted, are to be blocked as if they were open proxies. Any current or future editor who, after this decision is announced, makes substantial edits to any Scientology-related articles or discussions on any page is directed to edit on these from only a single user account, which shall be the user's sole or main account, unless the user has previously sought and obtained permission from the Arbitration Committee to operate a legitimate second account. They shall edit in accordance to Misplaced Pages policies and refrain from advocacy, to disclose on the relevant talk pages any circumstances (but not including personal identifying information) that constitute or may reasonably be perceived as constituting a conflict of interest with respect to that page, and not through a proxy configuration.

- For the Arbitration Committee, Mailer Diablo 01:31, 29 May 2009 (UTC)

Protect free speech

FYI,

-- Brangifer (talk) 08:03, 7 June 2009 (UTC)

Thank you.

Your work will last for long time. Misplaced Pages:Levels_of_competence is very simple, yet one of the more beautiful pages about the project. +sj+ 05:34, 10 June 2009 (UTC)

Possibly unfree File:Condmilk.jpg

A file that you uploaded or altered, File:Condmilk.jpg, has been listed at Misplaced Pages:Possibly unfree files because its copyright status is unclear or disputed. If the file's copyright status cannot be verified, it may be deleted. You may find more information on the file description page. You are welcome to add comments to its entry at the discussion if you are interested in it not being deleted. Thank you. Alx 91 (talk) 04:10, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

Documentation of sockpuppet investigation - where's the evidence?

Considering that this user retired back near the end of 2008 and never made any contributions after that, why is he/she indefinitely blocked as a "sockpuppet master"? Was the user allowed to defend itself? Why was no documentation provided? Note that I've opened up a thread about this here: Misplaced Pages talk:CheckUser#Documenting sockpuppet investigations.2C particularly conclusive cases. II | (t - c) 19:03, 27 June 2009 (UTC)

I replied at that thread. --Enric Naval (talk) 19:12, 27 June 2009 (UTC)
The use of an alternate account was an evasion of the remedy in Misplaced Pages:Requests for arbitration/Prem Rawat 2#Jossi required to resolve disputes before returning to this area, and also had the effect of evading scrutiny, and so it was a violation of WP:SOCK.   Will Beback  talk  02:35, 28 June 2009 (UTC)
No evidence in that case was presented regarding lingering disputes. How far do we have to dig to get a straight answer here? Does this basically amount to "before you come back, check in with us so we can slap you on the wrist"? Jossi is getting banned for that kind of process wankery? You guys are better than this. -- Ned Scott 12:47, 28 June 2009 (UTC)
If you look at Pergamino's edits, you'll see that he was intentially deceptive about his knowledge of Misplaced Pages and his favorite topic. Further, Pergamino started editing while there was an active RFAR in which Jossi would have been a party if he hadn't "retired". So the use of the sock was not only deceptive, but it served to evade ArbCom sanctions. Regarding the sock investigation, checkuser results are never released, so that's nothing unusual. The ArbCom itself made the call, not just a functionary or admin. See the notes at User talk:Pergamino. There's also evidence of past sockpppet use.   Will Beback  talk  18:27, 28 June 2009 (UTC)
If Jossi was thrown in as a party of the second arb case it would be very unlikely that any scansions on him would have been this severe. It's so easy to piss on good editors of the past and make them out to be villains, what with their deceptive and evil intentions. If I were to just speculate I would say that Jossi did this to avoid all the BS and get back to improving actual articles. It wouldn't excuse the violation of the arbcom case, sure, but it puts things into perspective. It sickens me to see editors treated like this. The taboo of the sockpuppet seems to trump all rational logic. -- Ned Scott 05:09, 29 June 2009 (UTC)
Why would you speculate? All of Misplaced Pages administration is against Jossi now? He broke the rules, he got spanked like he knew he would if he got caught, where's the issue here? -- Maelefique 05:18, 29 June 2009 (UTC)
It's pretty startling that even now nobody can point me to a sockpuppet investigation page where a Checkuser publicly confirmed the evidence of sockpuppeting, with some diffs. Can you point me to the page? Why are you so against public evidence? II | (t - c) 05:37, 29 June 2009 (UTC)
Checkuser investigations are routinely done without posting an investigation, and in many SPIs the only feedback is "confirmed". I'm not sure what other evidence is required beyond checkuser, but I assume the ArbCom could be contacted directly with legitimate inquiries.   Will Beback  talk  05:52, 29 June 2009 (UTC)
In User talk:Pergamino, the first comment is by User:Rlevse saying that he had checkusered the user, and then the Arcom clerk User:Tiptoety said that he had also seen some of the evidence and that he confirmed the basis for the block.
Also notice that the other sock User:Sepho said that he had communicated the identity of his main to an arbcom member, and that 8 hours later Arbcom member User:Stephen Bain (bainer) declined his unblock request saying that it was not a legitimate usage of an alternative account. --Enric Naval (talk) 10:49, 29 June 2009 (UTC)
I suggest contacting them about what evidence they found and how convincing it was and why. --Enric Naval (talk) 09:55, 29 June 2009 (UTC)
It seems likely that Jossi was using those sockpuppets inappropriately. But the problem is that the standard practice on Misplaced Pages is to use evidence which is not collected and organized systematicallym and sockpuppet ban templates which do not point to the evidence, so it's a huge hassle to find out when the sockpuppet verdict was a mistake, and only insiders know what happened. That's not sustainable, and it is a very cabal-like practice. II | (t - c) 17:50, 29 June 2009 (UTC)
Simply put: No. Checkuser evidence is private to protect the privacy of everyone involved. Even if there were an SPI page opened, you'd have no more information than a {{confirmed}} template on the page and a note acknowledging that the accounts were blocked: exactly what is available here. — Coren  10:17, 29 June 2009 (UTC)
Your underlying premise is that diffs and supporting evidence beyond a "Checkuser" confirmation are unnecessary, or that the public doesn't need to see this supporting evidence. Simply put: that's absurd. Plenty of people edit from the same locations in the same topics. Sockpuppet case investigation pages present the evidence (diffs), which are otherwise difficult to track down. They should be opened in any major case just to allow people to look for the evidence themselves. Also, the argument that this is to defend the accused's privacy seems weak. Sockpuppet investigation case pages do not violate the accused's privacy. The accused always benefits from some due process and transparency, as do we all. II | (t - c) 16:39, 29 June 2009 (UTC)
If you have a problem with the policy itself, then I would suggest that the correct place to have this discussion would be here or here. It would seem inappropriate to have this discussion on any user's talkpage unless there is something special about this user's ban. Are you posting on every user talkpage of confirmed sockpuppeteers? It would seem you haven't even attempted to discuss your views on checkuser confirmation on any policy pages yet, though that is the logical place to start. Also, you're assuming we only have the checkuser results to rely on, even though on the Sockpuppet investigations page we have this, "CheckUser does not solve cases. It provides additional evidence of a technical nature that can be considered along with behavioral evidence, and may help clarify whether misuse has taken place". I would think that if you really wanted to improve this process you would do so from the policy pages where the involved admins already are, and not rely on whoever wanders past this page. -- Maelefique 18:18, 29 June 2009 (UTC)
Did you miss the in the opening paragraph (Misplaced Pages talk:CheckUser#Documenting sockpuppet investigations.2C particularly conclusive cases)? I would prefer to discuss this in the policy area, but there were statements here that I wanted to respond to. See Misplaced Pages talk:CheckUser#Ground rules. II | (t - c) 19:07, 29 June 2009 (UTC)
So we should cut and paste this *entire* discussion to the appropriate talk pages instead of cluttering up userspace, is that what you're recommending? Seems entirely appropriate to me too. Would you think Sock puppetry or Sockpuppet investigations is best? Or possibly to one, with a note on the other linking it? -- Maelefique 19:18, 29 June 2009 (UTC)
I don't know about copy/pasting...the sockpuppet investigations (SPI) page is, I guess, a subpage of the sockpuppetry policy page, but the SPI page probably has a more traffic and therefore more people watching it. Right now it's sort of in Checkuser. I don't know how controversial this is. I dropped a notice over at WT:SPI. II | (t - c) 19:32, 29 June 2009 (UTC)
I'm not sure what the basis for this dispute is. Is there any doubt that Pergamino was a sock of Jossi's? Has Jossi denied it or complained about the process? I don't believe so. I think his silence is an implicit agreement with the finding.   Will Beback  talk  20:00, 29 June 2009 (UTC)
My impression is that retired users don't check their Misplaced Pages watchlist every couple days, or sometimes even at all. People move on with their lives. In the mess above there's some decent evidence that Pergamino was Jossi, but there's still no link to the initial request for Checkuser, what the basis was, ect. The link you provided (Misplaced Pages:Requests for arbitration/Prem Rawat 2#Jossi required to resolve disputes before returning to this area) had zero evidence - it was circular (Jossi is banned because ). The most convincing evidence is from Enric, who said that one of the socks basically admitted to being Jossi in an email. II | (t - c) 21:25, 29 June 2009 (UTC)
Note that mail was sent July last year and has nothing to do with more recent events. JN466 23:32, 29 June 2009 (UTC)

CU evidence is private. Arbcom gets reports/requests/etc of all sorts everyday. If a CU is justified, an CU check will be run, as was the case here. These are called 'private CUs' and happen all the time. The requirement for a CU is that the evidence presented meet CU requirements. An SPI report may or may not be filed. It is place to collect most sock reports. Arbcom handles a lot of private matters and we can not, nor do we need to, file an SPI when we get a report/request. In this Jossi case at hand, we hand on wiki evidence, private correspondence, and a CU check. All together a very solid case for socking was shown, plus Jossi did not notify us as required by the arbcom ruling. I can post the onwiki public evidence here if someone is interested. — RlevseTalk20:45, 29 June 2009 (UTC)

I think this is better discussed over at the thread I started or its subthread (Misplaced Pages talk:CheckUser#Ground rules). The question is - why do these requests need to be private? Are there any rules which "the community" can read governing how these private discussions go? And why can't ArbCom file an SPI? But please don't answer these questions here. II | (t - c) 21:25, 29 June 2009 (UTC)

2012 Election Need Your Feedback

I noticed you were a regular editor on the 2008 election page. Myself and other editors are odds on some edits we are trying to make to the page. Since you have already been involved in probably similar discussion, we would greatly appreciate hearing your feedback on the 2012 election discussion page under the Republicans and Ruled Out discussions http://en.wikipedia.org/Talk:United_States_presidential_election,_2012#Republicans.3F

David1982m (talkcontribs) 20:03, 4 August 2009 (UTC).

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I copied the Fair Use Rationale from File:Lacasabella.jpg. --Enric Naval (talk) 19:25, 6 June 2010 (UTC)

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You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the {{proposed deletion/dated files}} notice, but please explain why in your edit summary or on the file's talk page.

Please consider addressing the issues raised. Removing {{proposed deletion/dated files}} will stop the proposed deletion process, but other deletion processes exist. In particular, the speedy deletion process can result in deletion without discussion, and files for discussion allows discussion to reach consensus for deletion. Salavat (talk) 06:46, 28 November 2020 (UTC)

Proposed deletion of File:Rider-Waite-Smith deck.png

Notice

The file File:Rider-Waite-Smith deck.png has been proposed for deletion because of the following concern:

Redundant to the individual images on the Rider-Waite tarot deck

While all constructive contributions to Misplaced Pages are appreciated, pages may be deleted for any of several reasons.

You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the {{proposed deletion/dated files}} notice, but please explain why in your edit summary or on the file's talk page.

Please consider addressing the issues raised. Removing {{proposed deletion/dated files}} will stop the proposed deletion process, but other deletion processes exist. In particular, the speedy deletion process can result in deletion without discussion, and files for discussion allows discussion to reach consensus for deletion. Salavat (talk) 06:49, 28 November 2020 (UTC)

Proposed deletion of File:Digital painting of flower (monotone blue).jpg

Notice

The file File:Digital painting of flower (monotone blue).jpg has been proposed for deletion because of the following concern:

Orphaned file with no obvious value in transferring to Commons

While all constructive contributions to Misplaced Pages are appreciated, pages may be deleted for any of several reasons.

You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the {{proposed deletion/dated files}} notice, but please explain why in your edit summary or on the file's talk page.

Please consider addressing the issues raised. Removing {{proposed deletion/dated files}} will stop the proposed deletion process, but other deletion processes exist. In particular, the speedy deletion process can result in deletion without discussion, and files for discussion allows discussion to reach consensus for deletion. Salavat (talk) 06:53, 28 November 2020 (UTC)

"Aspirare" listed at Redirects for discussion

A discussion is taking place to address the redirect Aspirare. The discussion will occur at Misplaced Pages:Redirects for discussion/Log/2021 May 2#Aspirare until a consensus is reached, and anyone, including you, is welcome to contribute to the discussion. (t · c) buidhe 22:56, 2 May 2021 (UTC)

Misplaced Pages:Requests for arbitration/Prem Rawat: Contentious topic designation removed

Hello Jossi,

As a very late update to the Prem Rawat arbitration case, the contentious topic designation, previously "discretionary sanctions", originally "article probation", has been removed following a successful request for amendment.

Any actions previously taken in accordance with the contentious topic designation remain in force and are governed by the contentious topics procedure.

This notification may be mostly unnecessary, but as you had been a party to the original case, I thought you might be interested in hearing that after about 15 years, this remnant has been removed. Until today, it was listed at Misplaced Pages:General sanctions § Arbitration Committee-authorised sanctions.

Best regards,
~ ToBeFree (talk) 19:37, 10 October 2023 (UTC)

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