Misplaced Pages

Revision as of 19:45, 26 July 2005

Statement of the dispute

This is a summary written by users who dispute this user's conduct. Users signing other sections should not edit here.

This dispute involves the continued development of the Ludwig von Mises Institute article on wikipedia, which is currently the subject of a heated content dispute involving violations of WP:NPOV and the article's emphasis. User:Willmcw has engaged in generally disruptive behavior, heavy POV pushing on this article, personal attacks against other editors, and edits that are harmful to good faith efforts to develop this article. User:Cberlet has engaged in POV pushing, personal attacks, and belligerency towards other editors in response to polite requests of him on the article's talk page.

Description

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Willmcw

• User:Willmcw has engaged in extensive POV pushing aimed at inserting personal attacks and discrediting information against the LVMI, the article's subject.
• He's inserted and attempted to restore POV-driven material to draw associations with persons of known extremism and infamy such as David Duke
• He's been disruptive to efforts to expand and develop the article.
• He's repeatedly mischaracterized cited sources that differ from his personal POV as "blogs" as a basis for removing them
• He's inserted and restored sources that clearly qualify as "partisan political websites" in violation of Misplaced Pages:Reliable sources
• He's responded to calmly stated efforts to inform him of Misplaced Pages policies that conflict with his edits by dismissing them as "personal attacks" and generally ignoring any and all efforts by other editors to curtail the aforementioned disruptive behavior.
• He's engaged in personal attacks upon the occupation and employment of another editor.

Cberlet

• User:Cberlet has engaged in POV pushing similar to that of Willmcw
• He's initiated revert and editing wars
• He's responded to polite talk page requests with extreme belligerency and personal attacks.
• He's engaged in multiple personal attacks against other editors including attacks on political affiliation and the use of profanity.
• He's ignored multiple standing objections to the lack of neutrality in his edits and refused efforts to resolve these matters on the talk page.

Evidence of disputed behavior

(provide diffs and links)

Willmcw

1. - Inserted irrelevant & unconnected quotations from known racist David Duke to discredit other mainstream sources that differed with his POV. Labelled this edit "more info on the SPLC" to suggest it was innoccuous
2. - intentionally mislabelled edit description - he removed a NPOV phrasing about a source he favors that indicated its controversial nature, but described it in the edit line as simply "add citation"
3. - Removed two sourced statements that differed with his POV, falsely characterized one of the sources as a "blog" as grounds for removal
4. - Removed material rebutting a partisan source he added that was intended to balance the article per WP:NPOV, added unsourced guilt-by-association allegation about holocaust deniers - aimed at POV discrediting of article subject.
5. - Addition of lengthy critical paragraph sourced entirely from an extremely partisan political website. Material was often portrayed as factual rather than the viewpoint of the partisan group - violates Misplaced Pages:Reliable sources
6. - Addtl. repeat talk page misrepresentation of non-blog sources that differ with his POV as "blogs" as a basis to remove them.
7. - Personal attack on the occupation and employment of User:Nskinsella. Nskinsella has fully and voluntarily disclosed on Misplaced Pages that he is active with the LVMI. Willmcw nevertheless attacked him over this and attacked his motives, stating in the edit line to Nskinsella "I don't get paid by the LVMI" and stating in his message "I'd be hard to argue that faculty and staff of the LVMI don't have a agenda"

Cberlet

1. - Personal attack in description line - reverted an extensively described and detailed revision of his earlier edit with request to reconcile NPOV problems on the talk page and attacked the editor requesting talk page discussion with allegation of "shameless censorchip of criticsm"
2. - revert warring over same passage
3. - refusal to participate in talk page discussion over NPOV problems and other WP policy and guideline violations in his earlier edits
4. - bad faith assumption and more personal attacks - accused editor seeking his participation in talk page discussion wiht "This is just censorship"
5. - bad faith allegations in response to good faith effort to initiate talk page discussion
6. - lengthy personal attack on editor User:Rangerdude posted to Willmcw, attack on motives as well: "This passive/aggressive baloney from Rangerdude is tiresome. He now rules the LvMI page with an iron fist, in a perfect echo of the undemocratic elitist arrogance of the Institute he fawns over. The iron first in the velvet glove--the perfect metaphor."
7. - personal attacks and profanity directed against another contributer.
8. Spurious Plagiarism_allegations

   More evidence of sources having been cited in the article as well as in talk, in contrast to his allegations

9. Instructs an editor to "overhaul your attitude" in reply to an attempt to discuss recent and future edits
10. Remarks comparing statements made by an editor to the "homoeroticism of fascism"
11. Spurious accusation of vandalism
12. He admits to assuming bad faith

Applicable policies

{list the policies that apply to the disputed conduct}

1. WP:NPOV
2. WP:POINT
3. Misplaced Pages:Reliable sources
4. Misplaced Pages:No personal attacks
5. Misplaced Pages:Assume good faith

Evidence of trying and failing to resolve the dispute

(provide diffs and links)

Willmcw

Attempts at trying to resolve the dispute with Willmcw by multiple editors

1. - User:Nskinsella approaches Willmcw on NPOV problems regarding David Duke. User:DickClarkMises concurs and proposes the same on NPOV grounds. Willmcw refuses, feigns seriousness in adding Duke on the basis that he's "better known than" other more pertinent sources being used. Also generally disruptive in response - Willmcw's comments indicate he added Duke for reasons that were not constructive, to wit: another source already in the article allegedly makes it that "any general criticism" including Duke "seems appropriate." WP:POINT disruption.
2. - User:Rangerdude directs Willmcw to Misplaced Pages's "no personal attacks" policy in response to Willmcw's personal attack on Nskinsella's employment and occupation. States "For the sake of civility and with respect to wikipedia's editing guidelines, I would urge the editor in violation to refrain from such personal attacks upon the person of another editor be they direct or by implication. Thank you." No response given by Willmcw
3. - User:DH003i complains of disruptive and POV pushing behavior by some editors "who have been actively "working" to make this article mis-representative and of poor quality" and stating their "actions speak for themselves." This appears to be intended as a You know who you are so knock it off type warning to disruptive editing practices in general as DHoo3i did not name specific names it applied to. Willmcw reacts with hostility, accuses DH003i of making a "personal attack."
4. - User:Rangerdude responds to Willmcw's allegation against DH003i, states specific objections to Willmcw's disruptive edits (i.e. Duke) and politely requests that he cease and desist: "Myself and many others have suggested this to you in calm and reasonable terms many times with little result, hence the problem and recurring discussions of it. Given these many notes, I trust that you will conduct yourself more responsibly in the future." In response Willmcw ignores complaints about his editing practices, accuses Rangerdude of personal attacks as well and directs that the discussion be removed to his talk page.
5. - User:Rangerdude quotes and links to Misplaced Pages:Reliable sources passage against the use of partisan sources as a reminder to all editors and in reference to violations of it by Willmcw. Willmcw rudely responds, posts insinuations about rangerdude and mocks the quoting of this provision, ignores provision about use of partisan sources.
6. Attempts by User:Rangerdude to communicate with Willmcw above also prompt Willmcw to post a message to Rangerdude's talk page making more allegations that the requests of him are personal attacks. Rangerdude replies on Willmcw's talk page to address this allegation . Rangerdude responds that Willmcw has been ignoring "all attempts to calmly and rationally inform you of the problems many of your edits there are producing in light of Misplaced Pages's written policies and guidelines" and asks of Willmcw "Please do not mischaracterize these critiques of your edits as "personal attacks" and please cease and desist in your misrepresentation of myself and the other editors who have corrected you for your edits in order to bring them into compliance with Misplaced Pages policies. I would also appreciate it if you would abstain from making these false insinuations and allegations on both the article talk page and my personal talk page."

Cberlet

Attempts at trying to resolve the dispute with Cberlet by User:Rangerdude

1. - Detailed description of NPOV and other problems with his edits followed by a polite request to work for consensus first on the talk page and to fix the NPOV problems - "Upon consideration of the above and review of the aforementioned Misplaced Pages policies and guidelines, he or any other user is invited to propose the addition of materials here on the talk page." Cberlet rebuffed and ignored this request here with a rude 4-word response "Reverted. This is absurd."
2. - Attempt #2. Politely responded to Cberlet that "there's no need for hostility or rudeness" and politely directed him to WP:NPOV policy. Closed with polite 2nd invitation to discuss matter on talk page - "I strongly advise that you approach this in a more cooperative manner than has been exhibited to date. Should you do so your contributions and collaboration will be much appreciated. Thanks." Cberlet refused and attacked with allegation of "censorship"
3. - Attempt #3. Responded to "censorship" allegation and attack by politely directing Cberlet to Misplaced Pages:Assume good faith. Offered a third opportunity to discuss the matter, but this time with a warning that continued hostility would necessitate seeking dispute resolution: "I am patient enough to permit you another opportunity to do this, but in light of the hostility you have displayed despite these multiple attempts, I am prepared to pursue dispute resolution against you in short order if the hostility persists. Thanks." Refused again by denying the problems and making an inconsequential change.
4. - Attempt #4 - again politely requested a talk page discussion: "please propose your desired additions here and I will be happy to detail what I still find objectionable as well as propose collaborative revisions of it in a manner that is more likely to reach consensus among the half dozen or so editors who are actively involved in developing this article at the very moment. Thanks." Cberlet rudely refused, made personal and bad faith allegations, said efforts on the talk page were "not worth a damn" and said to go ahead with dispute resolution as mentioned.

Users certifying the basis for this dispute

(sign with ~~~~)

1. Rangerdude 00:04, 26 July 2005 (UTC)
2. DickClarkMises 03:54, 26 July 2005 (UTC)
3. Stephan Kinsella 19:06, 26 July 2005 (UTC)
4. Wyss 19:33, 26 July 2005 (UTC)

Other users who endorse this summary

(sign with ~~~~)

1. ¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸ 13:57, 26 July 2005 (UTC)(specific to Cberlet)

Response

This is a summary written by the user whose conduct is disputed, or by other users who think that the dispute is unjustified and that the above summary is biased or incomplete.

Response by Cberlet

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This is a blatant attempt to stage a confrontation to allow the complainant and allies to hijack a page and sanitize any serious criticism of the Ludwig von Mises Institute (LvMI).

It should be clear from a review of the discussion page that Rangerdude and other allies of LvMI did not engage in a serious attempt to edit in good faith, and repeatedly deleted material critical of the LvMI--no matter how I and others tried to rewrite the material to meet the objections raised.

Over time, the justifications for these deletions ranged through a series of contradictory demands:

——Simply dismissing the Southern Poverty Law Center as "partisan" and not a credible source (despite the fact that it is widely quoted in the mainstream media)(and then deleting text arbitrarily);

——Demanding that material not specifically cited to LvMI in a SPLC article be deleted, (and then deleting it arbitrarily).

——When the material was cited directly to the LvMI website, demanding that "original research" be deleted, (and then deleting it arbitrarily);

——Claiming the criticisms were in the "wrong" section, (and then deleting them arbitrarily);

——Deleting material and than demanding that all edits critical of LvMI be discussed on the talk page, despite the fact that they were being discussed.

This is a shameful episode and an attempt to impose ideological censorship on Misplaced Pages.

Users who endorse this summary (sign with ~~~~):

1. Cberlet 01:17, 26 July 2005 (UTC)
2. FeloniousMonk 04:36, 26 July 2005 (UTC) Cberlet describes a pattern which I have witnessed here before.

Response by Others

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Users who endorse this summary (sign with ~~~~):

Outside views

These are summaries written by users not directly involved with the dispute but who would like to add an outside view of the dispute.

View by Bishonen

I have clicked on the diffs offered and read them, and the edits by Willmcw and Cberlet that Rangerdude complains of seem perfectly reasonable to me. They consist mainly of good NPOV'ing of the article, IMO. If this is the evidence you've got, the accusations are groundless. I see little point in this RfC, but if you seriously want it to be accepted, you need to get hold of someone neutral to attempt mediation, however informally, so that you've got something other than your own side of arguments (including some flames) to put under "Evidence of trying and failing to resolve the dispute". That's not what that section is for, and dressing it up by calling your opponent's posts "allegations" and "attacks" and your own "polite" is just... well, I don't know what to call it, it just makes me laugh. "Responded to "censorship" allegation and attack by politely directing Cberlet to Misplaced Pages:Assume good faith". Man, that's some dispute resolution.

Users who endorse this summary (sign with ~~~~):

1. Bishonen | talk 02:04, 26 July 2005 (UTC)

View by JimWae

Should not 4 certifications be required against 2 people? Do we not need to remove doubt that this is an attempt at guilt by association, particularly since that is part of the issue regarding some of the edits? RfC should be split in two--JimWae 04:47, 2005 July 26 (UTC)

View by Sam Spade

Attempts at trying to resolve the dispute with Cberlet by User:Sam Spade

• Refusal of informal mediation
• more refusal of informal mediation
• Misplaced Pages:Requests_for_mediation#User:Cberlet_and_User:Sam_Spade
• Misplaced Pages:Requests for mediation/Cberlet and Sam Spade
• WP:TINMC#Christian_right_and_Political_correctness

View by Wyss

The article's purpose is to describe the organisation, including its history and what it does. Given the topic's polarization, any documented criticisms specific to the organisation should all be isolated in a separate section called criticisms or something similar. Any generic criticisms of the Austrian school of economics belong in that article, not this one. Wyss 19:44, 26 July 2005 (UTC)

Discussion

All signed comments and talk not related to a vote or endorsement, should be directed to this page's discussion page.