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Creation and Collaboartion

I remember in the aftermath of the storm, the Globe and Mail, or the Vancouver Sun, published a feature story on the history of Stanley Park. It went into detail about the eviction of August Jack and other event around the theft of the area. It's interesting to note that the Stanley Park page mentions little about the 99 year lease from the Crown, when Crown land is usually automatically up for land claims, especially when the Park is unceded territory. I have this striking feeling the media will be following this soon. If or when it comes out and a media scrum happens between the Squamish Nation, the Parks Board, and the City of Vancouver, this article will probably be a good one to work on since it will be a strong indicator of existance in Stanley Park. Mention of the remains excavated in he late 1890's, the eviction of the people, the villages, the other stories around this village. I'll pull out my "Stanley Park Secrets" and start citing sources right away. Any help would be appreciated! OldManRivers (talk) 03:20, 24 January 2008 (UTC)

Requested move

It has been proposed in this section that multiple pages be renamed and moved. A bot will list this discussion on the requested moves current discussions subpage within an hour of this tag being placed. The discussion may be closed 7 days after being opened, if consensus has been reached (see the closing instructions). Please base arguments on article title policy, and keep discussion succinct and civil. Please use {{subst:requested move}}. Do not use {{requested move/dated}} directly. Links: current log • target log • direct move

• X̱wáýx̱way → Xwayxway
• X̱wemelch'stn → Xwemelch'stn

– much as I don't like to have to, given what's happened at Sta7mes re the name change to the ambiguous Stawamus there, in order to prevent further such moves to allegedly more correct names I am requesting these be moved to regular romanizations in normal ASCII; there are several possible spellings for both of these, but per WP:Naming conventions (ethnicities and tribes)#Self-identification what the people prefer to call themselves, in these cases extended to the communities ("villages" is an inadequate name, partly because of the implications of "village" on dabs in BC, per what I commented on Talk:Stawamus#Requested move about that. I have omitted Esla7an from this RM because any other spelling for that is completely archaic or would induce a mispronunciation e.g. "Eslahan", though historically the more common rendering is Ustlawn. In terms of similar "anglicizations", Chiyakmesh cannot be moved to Cheakamus because of huge disambiguation problems and a primary topic that is decidedly the river, and not even the two locations other than the reserve community that go by that name already. Skookum1 (talk) 05:32, 22 March 2014 (UTC)

• Comment Senakw is also in the category, its historical rendering was "Snauq" or "Snawk". The native form once again is preferred re WP:NCET.Skookum1 (talk) 05:55, 22 March 2014 (UTC)

• Oppose Per WP:DIACRITICS Misplaced Pages neither encourages nor discourages diacritics. So the question should rather be if the article is best here or at Whoi Whoi and Homulchesan respectively, bot whether they should employ diacritics. Google book and scholar searches ignores diacritics (A problem well identified by In ictu oculi with regards to Vietnamese diacritics). A quick search of both shows no shortage of hits for Xwayxway and when you examine each they appear to employ the diacritics rather consistently.--Labattblueboy (talk) 02:36, 26 March 2014 (UTC)
  • If that was the case, why all the virulent criticism of Skwxwu7mesh and other titles for "not having English characters" (that's not verbatim but the gist of many complaints, such as "gibberish" and "this is stupid" and "what's the 7 mean?"). I'm well aware of lots of slashed-L titles out there and more; my intent here was to prevent the "anglicization" of this by someone who didn't like the look of Sta7mes and moved it to "Stawamus" based on google searches that included the mountain, river etc, and the IR name; and is pronounced differently. This is an attempt to "head off at the pass" suggestions the Chiyakmesh should be Cheakamus (village) as was done on the RM at Sta7mes (even though that infers a village municipality; I had dabbed it as Stawamus (Skwxwu7mesh village) in line with Haina (Haida village) so there could be no mistake of what was meant by village; that point has gone unanswered by the person who did that. I"m more than fine leaving this as it is, and its creator User:OldManRivers will be happy for sure, but there are going to be others who view this title as "not English" and will try and change it to something more suitable to their linguistic prejudices and narrow viewpoints.Skookum1 (talk) 06:05, 26 March 2014 (UTC)
    • The difference between this case and the others you cite is that here you remove just the diacritics, the others it's in fact different spelling and not a matter of diacritics. --Labattblueboy (talk) 11:54, 26 March 2014 (UTC)
      • WTF?? That's picayune; underscore-X vs X *is* a "spelling" issue, they are not the same characters; same as with the old /t'/ in the former special character St'at'imcets title (the English convention is to use t-apostrophe in to replace the conjoint t-special apostrophe single character of the van Eijk system; that is a spelling difference too, from the "old" "Stl'atl'imx" spelling which indicates the TL sound of the t-apostrophe but is a visual approximation of same (which is why a standard 7 instead of the below-the-line 7 used in actual Skwxwu7mesh snichim and Shishalhalem and others) or the underscore X in Skwxwu7mesh's original incarnation; the colon in Sto:lo is not a standard English character either (in Halqemeylem it's two inverted triangles; approximations of other character sets abound. Skwxwu7mesh is every bit as mcuh of a "spelling difference" from the mispronunciation encouraged by "Squamish" (and "Stawamus" also) as is this title. I reject your interpretation categorically....as nit-picking. And from WP:Wikilawyering:
        • 2. Abiding by the letter of a policy or guideline while violating its spirit or underlying principles;
        • 3. Asserting that the technical interpretation of the policies and guidelines should override the underlying principles they express
      • Underlying principles are in short supply around here....someone is going to bitch about thesee special characters, which like the /7/ are "not English" and "unpronounceable, or else we'd see this "anglicized" to its modern name Lumberman's Arch (actually teh Stanley Park Zoo is part of the same location also).Skookum1 (talk) 12:18, 26 March 2014 (UTC)
        • The only difference between X̱wáýx̱way and Xwayxway is their diacritics, the base letter spelling is the same. With Sta7mes vs Stawamus or Skwxwu7mesh vs Squamish the spelling is entirely different, the differences going beyond just diacritics (aka accents). The underlying spirit of the policy was to deal with modified letters not alternate base letter composition.--Labattblueboy (talk) 21:29, 26 March 2014 (UTC)
        • UJ3RK5 and Deadmau5 serve as examples of the use of numerals in titles; Sto:lo also has a nonstandard use of a standard ASCII character.Skookum1 (talk) 01:48, 27 March 2014 (UTC)
          • WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS.--Labattblueboy (talk) 02:09, 27 March 2014 (UTC)
            • Yeah, and so?? The legitimacy of Deadmau5 was hard-fought over and has been restored to that proper title. There is such a thing as WP:PRECEDENT also.Skookum1 (talk) 02:33, 27 March 2014 (UTC)

"Skwxwu7mesh" also shows up in searches, in diacritical form and otherwise; you are making no sense and I must refer again to the two wikilawyering points cited.Skookum1 (talk) 02:35, 27 March 2014 (UTC)

I may refer you to again to WP:DIACRITICS. I have to be honest I don't care for your tone. I may equally refer you to Misplaced Pages:Etiquette.--Labattblueboy (talk) 03:08, 27 March 2014 (UTC)

My "tone"? Try some AGF instead of oversensitive accusations; I'm saying that you are comparing apples with apples. If diacritics were a hard and fast guideline in the way you are claiming, the first Squamish RM would never have gone the way it did. And you are wikilawyering by narrow intrepretations of only one guideline. The full context here has to be considered. And yes, what you are saying makes no sense, that's an observation, not a personal attack.Skookum1 (talk) 03:50, 27 March 2014 (UTC)

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