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:::Your quibble with the title, which I am also not overly fond of, is not a valid excuse not to assume good faith. ] indicated quite clearly on ] that he is not married to the title either: -] (]) 02:03, 30 September 2014 (UTC)
:::Your quibble with the title, which I am also not overly fond of, is not a valid excuse not to assume good faith. ] indicated quite clearly on ] that he is not married to the title either: -] (]) 02:03, 30 September 2014 (UTC)
::::The title was a key point of the ongoing discussion. I am absolutely livid this article was created in such a way to trump and terminate that dialog and in clear contravention of the good faith support myself, and others, had given to create a separate theater-specific article. ] (]) 02:05, 30 September 2014 (UTC)
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I feel that because the US has intervened in Iraq before and lead intervention that the title should be "2014 American-led intervention in Iraq" SantiLak (talk) 02:53, 29 September 2014 (UTC)
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This article appears to exist to circumvent the edit block currently on 2014 military intervention against ISIS and largely duplicates material there. I propose it be merged with the aforementioned article.
Opinion in Brief
Support The article 2014 military intervention against ISIS contains all substantive information contained here, this article appears to exist solely to either (a) create a USA vanity article, (b) an article in which USA forces don't have to be presented in the same column as Iran and Hezbollah as with the previous article, or, (c) circumvent an edit block. A discussion that occurred at that page had wide consensus to create an Iraq-specific conflict article but not a US Iraq-specific conflict article (see: ) DocumentError (talk) 01:18, 30 September 2014 (UTC)
Oppose - I made this article as the majority of the community said an article for a separate part of the conflict was necessary. Not in any means did I ever use it as a way to bypass the Full protection of the parent article. If there is a similarity it is the info box which has valid information and a lot of information all on the conflict in Iraq. We need to break it down into two separate articles. One for Iraq and one for Syria. --Acetotyce (talk)01:31, 30 September 2014 (UTC)
A majority of the community - myself included - indicated an article for a separate theater of the conflict was necessary. There was never consensus to create an article on a separate theater of the conflict in which only the USA and its affiliates would be allowed mention. This article has no consensus for creation and its existence is duplicitous and gaming. DocumentError (talk) 01:36, 30 September 2014 (UTC)
I'm sure consensus isn't necessary to create a required article to help slim down the parent article which is getting overflowed I played it bold, the name may change if it is really a concern.. If you really want the article removed which I believe is what you are aiming for with the WP:CSD tag on the page I created along with a proposed merge tag... I believe this article should stay, Involvement from Iran should be added as it isn't part of the coalition, but remember that Iran played a role even before U.S. involvement. --Acetotyce (talk)01:49, 30 September 2014 (UTC)
Strong Oppose We need two separate articles for each intervention and one for the summary. This article really was not created in order bypass the full protection and I can't really see how it is an attempt to. The similarity in the infobox is valid considering the information shared between the two articles. Also I don't know why an article on the intervention is a USA vanity article because that term has been used a lot and just because an article focuses on the US and coalition intervention, that doesn't mean it is vanity, it is just reporting how the US and coalition partners are a very large part of the intervention. Also I think a CSD tag is going a little too far. SantiLak (talk) 01:40, 30 September 2014 (UTC)
The consensus was for two articles - one for each theater. The consensus was not for an article for the USA and an article for everyone else. DocumentError (talk) 01:41, 30 September 2014 (UTC)
Then add Iran to this article with citations. The article isn't just the US, it has coalition partners, Iraq, Shia militias, the kurds, and humanitarian partners. SantiLak (talk) 01:44, 30 September 2014 (UTC)
Strong oppose: The editor sought and obtained consensus and made it clear he wanted the article to parallel American-led intervention in Syria. If DocumentError can obtain consensus to expand the scope of this article or other articles covering military efforts against the Islamic State in Iraq or Syria, then the scope can be expanded; in fact, I am supportive of doing so. In my personal judgment as an editor, I do not believe it is appropriate to attempt to block a Iraq-focused WP:SPINOFF of the parent article because of the objection DocumentError cites. -Kudzu1 (talk) 01:48, 30 September 2014 (UTC)
Wrong. As someone who supported creation of a theater-specific article I can tell you I NEVER supported creation of a theater specific article in which everyone other than the U.S. and its allies would be excluded. DocumentError (talk) 01:52, 30 September 2014 (UTC)
OK. That's a good compromise. I've renamed it "2014 Conflict against ISIS (Iraq theater)" and will begin adding Qods Force into the infobox momentarily. DocumentError (talk) 02:01, 30 September 2014 (UTC)
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The existence of this article indicates strong systemic bias in favor of the United States. Though created with the intention to cover the Iraq theater of the current ISIS conflict it is named in such a way as to exclude all non-U.S. aligned actors involved in that theater. Does this article display systemic bias?
Opinion in Brief
Yes This article displays a US-centric worldview and is created with the intention of excluding and obfuscating involvement by non U.S.-government sanctioned parties. DocumentError (talk) 01:47, 30 September 2014 (UTC)
No This article does not display a US-centric worldview because the only party involved that is sanctioned by the US government is the US military and the other partners in Iraq are acting independently and were invited by the Iraqi government. There is not systemic bias and just because the United States is a large actor in an intervention does not mean the article does not recognize what other countries have done. This article was created in good faith and should stay. The issues you have should be resolved on the talk page, not through CSD tags. SantiLak (talk) 01:53, 30 September 2014 (UTC)
No - I created this page with the name it is to go with the sister article on the Syrian intervention, America led it with the aide of John Kerry whom went country to country gathering allies to join in. Not many countries are playing as large of a role as America is in Iraq but that is not likely to change as America appears to be putting the most effort --Acetotyce (talk)02:01, 30 September 2014 (UTC)
"Lead" means "to go before or show the way." RS indicates Iran was first into Iraq. Further, the image on your userpage seems to indicate you have a POV COI. You should recuse yourself from this discussion. DocumentError (talk) 02:02, 30 September 2014 (UTC)
Discussion
I think DocumentError, regrettably, fails to assume good faith here. I can't speak for the creator of this page, but personally, while I have stated my support for expanding this article's scope to cover the actions of Iran and other outside players not affiliated with the United States (so...basically just Iran, I guess, for now), I have seen absolutely nothing to indicate that Acetotyce created this page for the purposes DocumentError accuses him of. -Kudzu1 (talk) 01:51, 30 September 2014 (UTC)
The existence of the page indicates the page is "named in such a way as to exclude all non-U.S. aligned actors involved in that theater." The page is named 2014 American-led intervention in Iraq.DocumentError (talk) 01:54, 30 September 2014 (UTC)
You are forgetting to assume good faith by accusing me of forgetting to assume good faith. This is a factual statement: The existence of the page indicates the page is "named in such a way as to exclude all non-U.S. aligned actors involved in that theater." The page is named 2014 American-led intervention in Iraq.'DocumentError (talk) 02:00, 30 September 2014 (UTC)
The title was a key point of the ongoing discussion. I am absolutely livid this article was created in such a way to trump and terminate that dialog and in clear contravention of the good faith support myself, and others, had given to create a separate theater-specific article. DocumentError (talk) 02:05, 30 September 2014 (UTC)
Referencing and citation: not checked
