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Rename request 4

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: Close as disruptive; set RM moratorium of three months. This request is the fourth in three months and the third in a row with substantially the same proposed alternative. Whilst consensus can change, new discussions at such a rate are unhelpful. Timrollpickering (talk) 08:08, 8 December 2014 (UTC)

Cheryl Cole → Cheryl (singer) – This is getting stupid now, under WP:COMMONNAME this article should be called Cheryl (singer). Her legal name is not Cole. The main reason people still call her cole is the article's name. Every media outlet calls her Fernandez-Versini now. The current article name will cause confusion. 94.7.162.173 (talk) 10:08, 7 December 2014 (UTC) — 94.7.162.173 (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.

• Support. I don't know if it's not too soon after the previous discussion for this, but she does seem to be known more as Cheryl than Cole these days. This is Paul (talk) 12:53, 7 December 2014 (UTC)
• Support WP:COMMONNAME says, "If the name of a person, group, object, or other article topic changes, then more weight should be given to the name used in reliable sources published after the name change than in those before the change" (emphasis mine). Published sources who now use "Cheryl Cole" are in a tiny minority. --NeilN 16:10, 7 December 2014 (UTC)
• Question newspapers are calling her "formerly Carol Cole"...should en.wp treat her as Cat Stevens...or as who? What's the alternative example to Yusuf Islam? Am reversing previous opinion and thinking now Weak Support, as previous support for moving Cat Stevens to Yusuf Islam. In ictu oculi (talk) 16:29, 7 December 2014 (UTC)

Cheryl was married to England footballer Ashley Cole from July 2006 until September 2010, when she divorced him following the announcement of their separation earlier that year

• Support per my above comment here - I also commend the nom for doing this a month later and not a few days later (I was expecting this to appear the next day but surprised it wasn't). –Davey2010 • (talk) 16:35, 7 December 2014 (UTC)
• Oppose - WP:NCP discourages discarding her well-known surname: if the surname is "fairly often used", do not use only the first name along with parenthetical disambiguation. Look at Bing News results, but you can't go pass 14th page, limiting to only 136. Hmm... her name Cheryl Fernandez-Versini is also commonly used in articles. I oppose the parenthetical disambiguation and find "Cheryl Cole" not obscure or inaccurate per WP:NATURAL. --George Ho (talk) 17:03, 7 December 2014 (UTC)

@This is Paul, In ictu oculi, Davey2010: Your response? --George Ho (talk) 17:23, 7 December 2014 (UTC)

My response is that I think maybe WP:BLP should take precedence over WP:NCP sometimes. Just as I think there is an unpleasant odour around the titling issue of the Yusuf Islam BLP, and just as there is an unpleasant odour around the gratuitous "English name ..., Wogs-begin-at-Calais name ..." leads in a few of our BLPs. I am now thinking that this BLP title is problematic too. Is it right to be counting old sources, if the lady is divorced and still singing. In ictu oculi (talk) 17:33, 7 December 2014 (UTC)

WP:BLP doesn't mention naming an article (aside from privacy issues and one example in footnotes). Can you specifically show me which part of it we are referring to? --George Ho (talk) 17:47, 7 December 2014 (UTC)

I'll admit there's most definitely pros and cons to the renaming, I personally think renaming to said article and redirecting "Cheryl Cole" to said article is fine but that's just my opinion. –Davey2010 • (talk) 17:50, 7 December 2014 (UTC)

My response. Very different circumstances, I know, but we've moved articles like Kellie Maloney and Chelsea Manning (which involve a name change) fairly quickly. The circumstances there are somewhat more complex and controversial, so I'm not sure why we can't do it here. She got divorced, remarried, doesn't want to use her former married name, the media are not using it any more, so we should follow. Just out of interest, I tried to look up how long it was after she married Ashley Cole that we moved the article from Cheryl Tweedy to Cheryl Cole. They married in July 2006, but I haven't managed to locate the log. Can anyone shed some light on that? Also, for the record, I didn't nominate this, but fixed things for the nominator. This is Paul (talk) 18:18, 7 December 2014 (UTC)

Cheryl singer results include Fernandez-Versini. --George Ho (talk) 18:34, 7 December 2014 (UTC)

By the way, leave transgendered / transsexual people out of this. --George Ho (talk) 18:36, 7 December 2014 (UTC)

That issue was raised by someone in a previous discussion, so I'm not sure what the problem is with mentioning it again. Putting that aside though, I've no doubt if we trawled Misplaced Pages for long enough we could find any number of people who've changed their names through marriage, via deed poll and so on. I don't tend to keep an eye on celebrity marriages, but one that springs to mind is Samantha Womack, who changed her name upon marriage, and had been professionally known as Samantha Janus before then. We could also cite The Artist Formerly Known as Prince, but I think that predates Misplaced Pages. I suspect the reason your Bing search found hits for Cheryl Fernandez-Versini is because that is now her surname. The idea of a move to Cheryl Fernandez-Versini was pretty much ruled out some time ago, but what is certain is that she's no longer Cheryl Cole. This is now the fourth discussion we've had about moving the article in a ridiculously short amount of time, and I can imagine if we don't address this somehow then the subject will be raised again and again. If there's no rule preventing a move, then let's do it, and go back to doing something a bit more constructive. If we don't move it then there needs to be some kind of ban for a set period (say three months) on a fifth nomination. This is Paul (talk) 19:01, 7 December 2014 (UTC)

• Oppose per my statement in the previous RM; she hasn't always been known by a singular name. This is different from people like Adele or Madonna. Snuggums (talk / edits) 17:36, 7 December 2014 (UTC)

Oppose per above comments by George Ho and WP:NCP guidelines. IPadPerson (talk) 17:47, 7 December 2014 (UTC)

Umm... it's a guideline, not a policy. Either follow the rules or common sense, but I never heard (or forgotten) the singer "Cheryl" or "Cheryl Cole" until now. --George Ho (talk) 17:50, 7 December 2014 (UTC)

Oppose The OP is right - this is getting stupid now. Four page move requests in three months is in fact more than "getting stupid", but is way beyond stupid. Also to assume that the rest of the civilised world bases her used name around a Misplaced Pages article is flattering to the project, but rather unlikely. My opposition is based on the fact that this is quite simply a case of continual requests until succesful, and that arguments presented against the move in the previous three requests are still valid.

I am also interested in hearing further from Davey2010, who in the previous rename request stated "whatever the outcome this would be a last request I think" - well, not only are we here again, but Davey is seemingly supportive of a rename. Based on his previous comment, it would be fair to assume that he would oppose any new requests as he would support the outcome of the last one? Chaheel Riens (talk) 18:42, 7 December 2014 (UTC)

Maybe that's because I forgot that I previously said that ? ... With all respect I can't remember every fucking sentence I say on here you know!

Back on topic - I will however admit saying "whatever the outcome this would be a last request I think" was a poor statement to make and shouldn't have said it since I can't control who makes a request, However I never stated I wouldn't make another !vote if one arose,

Thanks, –Davey2010 • (talk) 19:05, 7 December 2014 (UTC)

• Oppose - It should remain as Cheryl Cole. Professional she is now known as "Cheryl", legally she is now known as "Cheryl Fernandez-Versini" but most importantly, she is commonly known as "Cheryl Cole", and has always will be. I guarantee that when people google her, people goole "cheryl cole". She ha never been known as just Cheryl either, unlike Rihanna, Madonna, Adele etc. I know Beyonce was change to Beyonce from Beyonce Knowles, but she has really always been known as Beyonce, even in DC.  — ₳aron 18:59, 7 December 2014 (UTC)
• Support But suggest Cheryl Fernandez-Versini her professional name on television programmes such as the x-factor. The current designation makes Misplaced Pages, I think, seem either out of touch or utterly obtuse. Gregkaye ✍♪ 20:13, 7 December 2014 (UTC)

Previously, you opposed "Fernandez-Versini"; what changed your mind? Also, to what designation are you referring? --George Ho (talk) 22:12, 7 December 2014 (UTC)

• Time changed my mind. It didn't take very much. I consider the current Misplaced Pages designation Cheryl Cole as either out of touch or utterly obtuse. It's not her current name. Gregkaye ✍♪ 01:44, 8 December 2014 (UTC)

• Oppose, the article title needs to have a surname (family name). She became famous as Cheryl Cole. Newspapers and the BBC either call her Cheryl Fernandez-Versini or Cheryl Cole. Sooner or later the article will need to be moved to her new family name (if she sticks with it). There are other singers called Cheryl; Cheryl (singer) is not a helpful article title. Imagine if we applied the Cheryl (singer) article name concept to other articles Angela (politician) or Red Ed (politician); it is not sensible. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Toddy1 (talk • contribs) 22:07, 7 December 2014 (UTC)
• Oppose "Cheryl Cole" is WP:NATURALDAB and fairly common. AND still in use -- 7Nov2014,9Nov2014,20Oct201420Oct2014 -- "Cheryl Cole" is quite clearly used as the headline descriptor, therefore the most visible name to the readership of these. -- 67.70.35.44 (talk) 06:16, 8 December 2014 (UTC)
• Comment I'm fairly sure this is the 6th or 7th move nomination, not the 4th, unless you mean 4th in 2014 -- 67.70.35.44 (talk) 06:18, 8 December 2014 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Puffery

This article reads like a publicity puff. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 95.150.224.222 (talk) 14:49, 5 July 2015 (UTC)

Well, you know what to do. This is Paul (talk) 15:13, 5 July 2015 (UTC)

Jimmy Wales today deprecated the use of Misplaced Pages by showbusiness agents for promoting their clients. Clearly this is one of those clients. In my view. 78.151.28.113 (talk) 17:54, 5 October 2015 (UTC)

This article has always suffered from NPOV and COI problems. It isn't just the PR promotion, it's the editing by deluded fans. All reality TV BLPs tend to be like this and I don't have a solution. --Ef80 (talk) 09:18, 5 April 2016 (UTC)

Ef80. Thank you for that. We could press for Z-listers to be barred I suppose. 78.151.24.27 (talk) 14:49, 21 April 2016 (UTC)

Name change

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Moratorium mentioned above has passed. She has made it very clear that she is (and wishes to be known as) Cheryl Fernandez-Versini. When Bruce Jenner and Bradley Manning changed their names, their wikipedia page was changed within seconds to reflect their new identities, despite the fact that most people still know them as Bruce and Bradley respectively. Fernandez-Versini is being treated unfairly and this should be rectified. The fact that her name change came about via marriage rather than a sex change should have no bearing on its validity. Misplaced Pages, as an encyclopedia, should reflect facts not opinion. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.133.12.233 (talk) 13:42, 18 July 2015 (UTC)

WP:COMMONNAME applies. A google search for Cheryl Cole turns up 21,200,000 results and 1,630,000 for Cheryl Fernandez-Versini. It does not matter what she wants to be called, we have to go by Misplaced Pages's policies.--5 albert square (talk) 04:03, 19 July 2015 (UTC)

Not going to reopen this right now but it's not that simple. WP:COMMONNAME says, "If the name of a person, group, object, or other article topic changes, then more weight should be given to the name used in reliable sources published after the name change than in those before the change" (emphasis mine). --NeilN 04:09, 19 July 2015 (UTC)

I also won't file another move request, but it is perhaps worth noting that the page move from Cheryl Tweedy to Cheryl Cole took place on 27 July 2006, twelve days after her marriage to Ashley Cole, when (presumably) the number of search results for her married name would have been considerably fewer than those for her maiden name. I do also think we need to address the apparent discrepancy between this case and the others discussed at length here. This is Paul (talk) 18:08, 19 July 2015 (UTC)

Bruce Jenner returns 105 million results. Caitlyn Jenner 62.2 million. Bradley Manning return 18.5 million; Chelsea 10.6 mil. Where's the consistency? Why does it matter what the two people that I mentioned want to be called but not what the woman in question wants? 78.133.12.233 (talk) 07:19, 19 July 2015 (UTC)

But people still call her Cheryl Cole whether she likes it or not.  — Calvin999 20:12, 19 July 2015 (UTC)

I'm not sure how to filter down Google results to a date range (it used to be easy!) but looking on Google News (which I believe only shows recent stuff (not sure what "recent" means exactly)), there are 648,000 results for "Cheryl Fernandez-Versini" and 239,000 results for "Cheryl Cole". In the latter search, there are still many mentions of "Fernandez-Versini". –anemoneprojectors– 14:17, 20 July 2015 (UTC)

Type in your search term, then you need to go to Search tools > Any time > Custom range, and enter the dates you want into the boxes. Hope this helps. This is Paul (talk) 15:03, 20 July 2015 (UTC)

Unfortunately it doesn't because, as I already suspected, it doesn't give the number of results. –anemoneprojectors– 15:37, 20 July 2015 (UTC)

• Personally I think the name should stay, Whether she hates it or not atleast for now millions of people know her by her surname, Perhaps in a year or 2/3 it could be moved but for now IMHO it should stay . –Davey2010 15:16, 20 July 2015 (UTC)

I think it would be best to rename this article Cheryl (singer) per WP:COMMONNAME. Not once in the last eight months have I heard her last name associated with her and she has been known by the mononym "Cheryl" for her latest two albums. Just like how Beyoncé only goes by her mononym, so should Cheryl. 2601:8C:4001:DCF4:F054:442E:C90D:5EFA (talk) 18:08, 21 July 2015 (UTC)

Per WP:MONONYM, "don't use a first name (even if unambiguous) for an article title if the last name is known and fairly often used". I only ever hear her referred to as Cheryl Fernandez-Versini, or sometimes Cheryl Cole, but rarely as just Cheryl. Her last name is known and is very often used, unlike people such as Shakira - I couldn't even guess at her last name even though I've heard it before. Similarly, Kylie Minogue is usually called just "Kylie" and she has used the mononym professionally, but her article is not and should not be renamed to reflect a mononym because her last name is known and often used, the same as Cheryl F-V. –anemoneprojectors– 15:20, 25 July 2015 (UTC)

Cheryl's name - used both professionally and personally - is Cheryl Fernandez-Versini. She no longer uses the name Cheryl Cole professionally or personally, and the UK media seem to always call her Cheryl Fernandez-Versini now. Other examples: the actress Jessica Hynes established her career under the name Jessica Stevenson before changing it after marriage. Her page was change to reflect her new name. Another example - the director Sam Taylor-Wood and actor Aaron Johnson married and both took the surname Taylor-Johnson. Both of their pages have been retitled with their new names, despite both (especially Taylor-Wood) having established careers under their former names. It seems unfair to still use Fernandez-Versini's former married name. Robyn2000 (talk) 08:21, 23 July 2015 (UTC)

I may have mentioned elsewhere that there's also Samantha Womack, who was Samantha Janus for years before she married and changed her name, and we moved that article. And no doubt we could find scores of other examples. The only thing we seem to be agreed on here is that we don't agree. This is Paul (talk) 15:40, 25 July 2015 (UTC)

I would certainly support a pagemove to Cheryl Fernandez-Versini. –anemoneprojectors– 14:30, 26 July 2015 (UTC)

Me too. I feel all the factors discussed above in favour of the name change are well explained and delineated. I don't see why she should be referred to as Cheryl Cole, and not Cheryl Fernandez Versini. --WonderBoy1998 (talk) 18:09, 6 August 2015 (UTC)

As mentioned, Cheryl is the common name used. This article needs a name change and those who oppose the fact need something better to do. The media in the UK call her Cheryl Fernandez-Versini so the article should be either "Cheryl Fernandez-Versini" or "Cheryl Fernandez-Versini (Cheryl Cole)" m.laverick (talk) 12:59, 12 August 2015 (UTC)

Seriously? We don't need to "move for a name change". JUST FUCKING CHANGE IT! SHE HAS NOTHING TO FUCKING DO WITH ASHLEY COLE YOU OUT DATED FUCKING PRICKS!--82.3.247.25 (talk) 01:33, 25 August 2015 (UTC)

I still prefer "Cheryl Cole", as I believe it trumps meets commonname over Fernandez-Versini, but I have to say that's a well thought out and profoundly convincing discussion from 82.3.247.25 there. Chaheel Riens (talk) 09:47, 25 August 2015 (UTC)

I don't think many sources since her marriage still call her Cheryl Cole, as that's neither her legal nor her professional name. You might prefer it but she definitely doesn't! Can we get on with a move request now to try to gain consensus one way or the other? –anemoneprojectors– 10:01, 26 August 2015 (UTC)

• edited curse words* I'm on Team Cole. Cheryl divorced Ashley five years ago, and even then she still called herself Cheryl COLE or simply Cheryl. Her reason given was because she was better known as Cole rather than Tweedy at the time. Even if she still had changed her name back to Tweedy, the general public would still call her Cole. Hell, it's been a year since she got married and whenever anyone I know talks about her, they call her Cheryl COLE. It doesn't matter if she is no longer married to Ashley. Some women are well-known by their ex-husbands names even after divorced. She hasn't used FV (it's a pain to type out the full form while Cole is just 4 letters, plus I hate double names) on any promotional material, has she? Look at things like her book, her music, her perfume, which are either released under the name Cheryl Cole or just Cheryl. And what if she divorced JB? Would she keep FV or go back to Cole or Tweedy or just simply go as Cheryl? Why not just settle this debate by calling the article Cheryl or Cheryl (singer), as her promotional stuff (music, perfume etc.) is just released under her first name? And about the more common name debate, what do you think people are more likely to type into Google? The overly-long double name or the four-letter, easy to spell/pronounce/remember Cole which she has been known as for the last NINE years? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.184.185.10 (talk • contribs)

Requested move 26 August 2015

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: moved. The consensus is that since she changed here name, she is most commonly referred to as "Cheryl Fernandez-Versini" in reliable sources. Jenks24 (talk) 20:42, 3 September 2015 (UTC)

Cheryl Cole → Cheryl Fernandez-Versini – She has been known as this name for some time now. Looking at Google results, typing in "Cheryl Cole", the first suggestions are now for "Cheryl Fernandez Versini". Other than when a fellow X Factor judge accidentally called her Cole, I'm not aware that any other media call her this name. 5 albert square (talk) 10:33, 26 August 2015 (UTC)

• Support per prior discussion. This is her name, both legally and professionally, and the media no longer call her Cheryl Cole. –anemoneprojectors– 11:01, 26 August 2015 (UTC)
• Support - I think it's now an acceptable time to change it, too.  — Calvin999 11:10, 26 August 2015 (UTC)
• Support - Truth be told I honestly hate the name!, But that aside I'd imagine most people would now know her as "Cheryl Fernandez-Versini", The article can't stay as "Cheryl Cole" forever so now seems a better time than any to move it. –Davey2010 14:47, 26 August 2015 (UTC)
• Support per above. FoCuS contribs; talk to me! 00:03, 27 August 2015 (UTC)
• Support even this toilet attendant thumping "thug" deserves acknowledgement of her own name. This change should have been made long ago. Issues such as relate to Hillary Clinton do not apply here with the subject consistently using and insisting on the use of the proposed name. GregKaye 11:09, 27 August 2015 (UTC)
• Support Clearly her professional name, and something we've done for countless others in a far quicker timeframe, including the lady herself on the occasion of her previous marriage. Oh, and btw, why is there no mention of her second marriage under personal life? This is Paul (talk) 12:04, 27 August 2015 (UTC)
• Oppose — Longstanding career as "Cheryl Cole", and even in her professional singing career, she only goes by "Cheryl". A one-year marriage is hardly worth warranting a move, when the majority of her career, both domestically and internationally, she's been referred to as "Cheryl Cole". In a standard Google search, "Cheryl Cole" pulls in 19,300,000 results, while "Cheryl Fernandez-Versini" pulls in 3,010,000 results. That is a difference of 16,290,000 results. In a Google News search, "Cheryl Cole" pulls 1,890,000 results, while "Cheryl Fernandez-Versini pulls 541,000 results, again a significant difference. Per this, "Cole" still pulls a stronger presence, which relates to the common-name policy. livelikemusic 01:09, 28 August 2015 (UTC)
• Support WP:COMMONNAME says, "If the name of a person, group, object, or other article topic changes, then more weight should be given to the name used in reliable sources published after the name change than in those before the change" (emphasis mine). Published sources who now use "Cheryl Cole" are in a tiny minority. --NeilN 01:22, 28 August 2015 (UTC)

Comment But even in the search results, Cole is still associated to Cheryl's reports, and shouldn't that hold significant weight, especially within her music career, which she is most known for, especially since it also states: "In determining which of several alternative names is most frequently used, it is useful to observe the usage of major international organizations, major English-language media outlets, quality encyclopedias, geographic name servers, major scientific bodies, and notable scientific journals. A search engine may help to collect this data; when using a search engine, restrict the results to pages written in English, and exclude the word "Misplaced Pages". When using Google, generally a search of Google Books and News Archive should be defaulted to before a web search, as they concentrate reliable sources (exclude works from Books, LLC when searching Google Books). Search engine results are subject to certain biases and technical limitations; for detailed advice on the use of search engines and the interpretation of their results, see Misplaced Pages:Search engine test." The search engine results for News show favor for "Cole" over "Fernandez-Versini", a.k.a. significant weight, a.k.a. the most frequently used name, especially within major international organizations. livelikemusic 01:35, 28 August 2015 (UTC)

You're ignoring the time factor. Limit your searches to the past year and you get vastly different results. --NeilN 01:47, 28 August 2015 (UTC)

Cut down to the past year, "Cole" still maintains 4,480,000 results while "Fernandez-Versini" maintains 1,480,000 results in the overall Google search from the past-year; "Cole" is still the significant majority. As well with "Book" results, "Cole" receives a total of 1,230 results while "Fernandez-Versini" holds 522 results. livelikemusic 01:50, 28 August 2015 (UTC)

How (and why) are you cutting down general search results? News gives 525K to "Fernandez-Versini" and 95K to Cole. --NeilN 02:02, 28 August 2015 (UTC)

It requests which names are most-frequently used; it does not state (in its paragraph) that it is following the person's name change itself. As it also states: Misplaced Pages does not necessarily use the subject's "official" name as an article title; it prefers to use the name that is most frequently used to refer to the subject in English-language reliable sources. This includes usage in the sources used as references for the article. So you're saying her changing her name overpowers the sources within the article, and the overall news and books results? I'd think not, because she could easily divorce Mr. Fernandez-Versini tomorrow, especially considering in her music career she's predominately known as either "Cheryl Cole" or "Cheryl". livelikemusic 02:06, 28 August 2015 (UTC)

And again, you're ignoring the time factor. Let's take the Bombay/Mumbai naming as an example. Bombay has centuries' worth of academic books, papers, literature, newspaper articles, travel guides, and pop culture references behind it. It would take Mumbai decades and decades to catch up. But our article is named Mumbai because that's what is commonly used now. --NeilN 02:13, 28 August 2015 (UTC)

I'm actually not ignoring it, I'm more so pointing out other factors and more so trying to figure out why those are being ignored, especially when it comes to sources (which Misplaced Pages relies heavily on). And comparing a singer and television personality to a historical location is kind of an unfair comparison, wouldn't you say so? livelikemusic 02:16, 28 August 2015 (UTC)

Not at all, the same guidelines apply. --NeilN 02:22, 28 August 2015 (UTC)

But my question is still not answered, you're saying TIME outweighs the vast majority of sources within the article, which the common-name policy also calls to take into account? That seems a bit contradictory, don't you think? That's saying the past 10-12 months is worth more than 10+ years of sources and notability within the music industry? livelikemusic 02:25, 28 August 2015 (UTC)

The music industry is not exempt from all the clauses in WP:COMMONNAME, including the one I quoted in my support !vote. --NeilN 12:36, 28 August 2015 (UTC)

• oooo, look at this:

"cheryl Fernandez-Versini" gets "About 578,000 results" for the last years news

"cheryl cole" gets "About 59,100 results" while

GregKaye 16:51, 28 August 2015 (UTC)

Even just looking at "recent" Google News, CFV has 591,000 results, CC has 265,000 results. –anemoneprojectors– 20:04, 28 August 2015 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Requested move 31 October 2015

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: Not moved. (non-admin closure) Natg 19 (talk) 02:27, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

Cheryl Fernandez-Versini → Cheryl (entertainer) – I truly apologize for bringing this issue up again, but I truly feel that since there has been so much debate over what her last name should be on Misplaced Pages, it should just be moved to Cheryl (entertainer) because that is her stage name and then we truly don't have to worry about another move again. 2601:8C:4001:DCF4:95CE:54AC:9EA7:1B6C (talk) 14:34, 31 October 2015 (UTC)

• Oppose since it took us so long to reach the current decision, and Cheryl Fernandez-Versini is her name at the end of the day. How ever we choose to name this article someone is always going to disagree, and discussions like this can become disruptive. Might I suggest another three or six month moratorium on move requests to stop possible repetition. This is Paul (talk) 15:19, 31 October 2015 (UTC)
• Oppose six months moratorum. In ictu oculi (talk) 00:51, 1 November 2015 (UTC)
• Oppose per WP:SINGLENAME; "Fernandez-Versini" is so often used, so let's not use parenthetical disamibuguation then. Okay? --Georgie says "Happy Halloween!" (BOO!) 04:21, 1 November 2015 (UTC)

  I didn't see that this was proposed before. George Ho (talk) 15:05, 1 November 2015 (UTC)

• Oppose, since thanks to redirects, she can be found using any of the three surnames she has used to date. Bearhair (talk) 10:01, 1 November 2015 (UTC)
• Strong Oppose - Well it took roughly 6 request moves until it was moved to her new name so it doesn't have a chance in hell of ever being moved to a new name, No point in starting all this shit again - We all eventually agreed on the new name so it should stay at the new name. –Davey2010 12:12, 1 November 2015 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Divorce?

Look: Cheryl Fernandez Versini Google News search. Also look:

Cheryl Fernandez-Versini is lodging divorce papers to end her stormy second marriage, it was reported on Sunday.

— Cheryl Fernandez-Versini 'to end stormy second marriage after 19 months' - The Telegraph

The X Factor judge has begun formal legal proceedings by filing paperwork which cites irreconcilable differences between her and partner Jean-Bernard.

— Cheryl Fernandez-Versini is DIVORCING husband Jean-Bernard after 18 months of marriage - The Mirror

Is Cheryl getting divorced, there seems to be quite a bit in the tabloids and gossip magazines at the moment about this, but I'm not sure there's anything substantial in more reliable sources yet? Is there?  Seagull123  Φ  23:12, 9 January 2016 (UTC)

People were adding this last night, and I was one of those to revert it since there didn't seem to be many reliable sources at the time. The Telegraph adds more weight to it, but from past experience we know the quality newspapers can be wrong as well. I guess we wait for her to make an official announcement, as no doubt she will in time. Then cue the raft of debates about what to call her next. This is Paul (talk) 14:19, 10 January 2016 (UTC)

"Then cue the raft of debates about what to call her next" - I thought exactly that. I'd go for "Bob", as at the current rate she's going through names it's only a matter of time before she gets to this one. Chaheel Riens (talk) OK. But I wouldn't go for Bob Marley. He isn't her type of music. And though he's dead, he was talented78.149.208.161 (talk) 13:14, 20 January 2016 (UTC)15:06, 10 January 2016 (UTC)

Sigh...I really didn't expect it to begin this soon. This is Paul (talk) 19:13, 10 January 2016 (UTC)

What are you sighing for?78.149.208.161 (talk) 01:18, 20 January 2016 (UTC)

Because I know we're going to have months of pointless arguments about what to call her, and I'd hoped it wouldn't start quite so soon. This is Paul (talk) 13:27, 20 January 2016 (UTC)

What's the big deal? She isn't a head of state or the Pope. She's getting a divorce. Like millions of other ordinary peopleWythy (talk) 19:02, 10 January 2016 (UTC)

Change of name 2

Any takers for this?78.151.30.236 (talk) 19:04, 10 January 2016 (UTC)

I am in definitely! Guys let's be honest, she is rarely known as Cheryl Fernandez-Versini (especially outside of UK, note that she is famous in Europe too). I suggest we move her simply to Cheryl, because obviously that is how she wants people to know her (albums/singles artworks, YouTube videos) whenever she is getting a divorce or no. Also, the inconsistency of her name/surname (Cole/Fernandez-Versini song/album/whatever) on the Misplaced Pages articles is awful. — Tom 19:07, 10 January 2016 (UTC)

While we will no doubt need to address this eventually, now is probably not the time. We should wait for an official announcement from the lady herself. This is Paul (talk) 19:10, 10 January 2016 (UTC)

Absolutely not. She isn't even divorced yet and for all we know she may still want to keep the name Fernandez-Versini. Besides "Cheryl Fernandez-Versini" gets a lot more hits than "Cheryl" and Cheryl Fernandez-Versini is what she is referred to in the media.--5 albert square (talk) 19:12, 10 January 2016 (UTC)

Do you understand how many people get confused when they see Cole and Fernandez-Versini used on her articles titles at the same time? Even I haven't checked her bio article recently, I was freaking surprised when I saw it being titled as it is right now. It's stupid and ridiculous. At the end of the day it's not how the media calls her, it's how SHE wanted to be called. Obviously, she wants to go simply by Cheryl. We also discussed this for Beyonce Knowles which is now only Beyonce on Misplaced Pages. And yeah, I would like to see the statistics where Cheryl Fernandez-Versini gets more hits than Cheryl. — Tom 19:15, 10 January 2016 (UTC)

Comment - if you read the previous suggestions, you'll know that it's not just how she wants to be known as, but a blend of what she wants to be known as, and what the common name in media presents her as, along with the name the public associated her with. This is where the problem lies, in that a sizeable percentage of these still refer to her - or know her - as Cheryl Cole. Cat Stevens springs to mind. Chaheel Riens (talk) 19:25, 10 January 2016 (UTC)

Well I was not here when the name change of the article was happening, but honestly, yes I would say it should stayed Cheryl Cole rather than Cheryl Fernandez-Versini, which is her legal name now. However, the most logical solution for me would be Cheryl (singer) with both former surnames and the one she is currently using redirecting to it. I am very concerned about the subsequent differ usage of Cole and Fernandez-Versini on her other articles names (ex. The Flood (Cheryl Cole song) vs. Only Human (Cheryl Fernandez-Versini album))... And I don't think the right decision is moving Cole to Fernandez-Versini (on the article titles being used) — Tom 19:29, 10 January 2016 (UTC)

You might want to read WP:COMMONNAME in particular the part that refers to media reports.--5 albert square (talk) 00:24, 11 January 2016 (UTC)

I have read the part, and yeah, although maybe most of the media right now calls her Cheryl Fernandez-Versini it doesn't mean that Misplaced Pages should call her too. Why? I already explained why. The media subsequently calls her Cheryl and Cheryl Cole too. There is no need to write 'Cheryl Fernandez-Versini' on Google in order to get results for her, writing simply 'Cheryl' is enough. Also, I explained the problem why her name usage on Misplaced Pages right now is vague and badly shaped. We need to choose one name for her which will be present in all of her articles and according to me Cheryl Fernandez-Versini is not the right one. — Tom 06:52, 11 January 2016 (UTC)

WP:MONONYM says: "don't use a first name (even if unambiguous) for an article title if the last name is known and fairly often used". Yes she uses the mononym for her recording career, but in her every day life, in the media, and when working on The X Factor, she is called Cheryl Fernandez-Versini, so the last name should be used in the article title. A Google search for "Cheryl" brings up her official websites with just "Cheryl", and then the rest are all "Cheryl Fernandez-Versini", until I get a result about someone called Cheryl Wheeler on page 3. AnemoneProjectors 07:56, 11 January 2016 (UTC)

Wasn't familiar with her, my music collection expandeth. :) This is Paul (talk) 18:37, 12 January 2016 (UTC)

• Wow!, After all those requests ... and the moment we eventually allow it she decides to divorce!, I sure as shit am not doing all this again ... so personally think we should either Keep it at this name or move back to Cheryl Cole (The latter would probably be pointless now but it's just a suggestion), No point in moving to any other name as the moment it gets moved she'll probably divorce so thus all these requests would be a waste of time. –Davey2010 19:16, 12 January 2016 (UTC)

Well, she still has "Mrs C" tattooed on the back of her neck. I suppose it might mean "Mrs Cheryl" of course.92.31.90.226 (talk) 02:24, 13 January 2016 (UTC)

Look. Call a spade a spade. Cheryl is about to be divorced. Live with it.92.31.90.226 (talk) 02:16, 13 January 2016 (UTC)

Incidentally Steve Allen calls her Cheryl Spagbol on LBC. Not terribly funny but mildly appropriate.92.31.90.226 (talk) 02:19, 13 January 2016 (UTC)

Well I don't suppose it'll catch on, so I guess a move to Cheryl Spagbol is out of the question. :) A redirect, perhaps? This is Paul (talk) 19:23, 13 January 2016 (UTC)

Well, I suspect that this may please @Davey2010: (if the Daily Fail can be believed!), according to them Cheryl will stay as Cheryl Fernandez-Versini. I suspect it could be something to do with the fact that she may have to wait 3 years for her divorce!--5 albert square (talk) 01:50, 20 January 2016 (UTC)

Oh I'm delighted, Think I'll have a beer I mean why not it's only 2:30 in the morning , She shouldn't be allowed to divorce full stop ... Infact she should never marry again ... That way it keeps us all happy lol, –Davey2010 02:35, 20 January 2016 (UTC)

New section on her personality?

This should be added because Cheryl has an unusual, and in my view outstanding, personality. Who agrees?78.149.210.240 (talk) 11:38, 27 January 2016 (UTC)

So what kind of things would you say in it? I'm struggling to understand how a section like this would actually work. As we don't have one like it for other celeb articles I'm not sure there's a need for it here, so it's over to you to sell the idea to us. This is Paul (talk) 16:30, 27 January 2016 (UTC)

What reliable sources would confirm her personality type? Or would it be purely a Misplaced Pages editor's opinion? AnemoneProjectors 10:10, 29 January 2016 (UTC)

External links modified

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just added archive links to 29 external links on Cheryl Fernandez-Versini. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add {{cbignore}} after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add {{nobots|deny=InternetArchiveBot}} to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:

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Semi-protected edit request on 28 February 2016

This edit request to Cheryl Fernandez-Versini has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request.

Please change Cheryl Fernandez Versini to Cheryl as she is now divorcing husband Jean Bernard Fernandez Versini after 18 months. I would also like to request that you update Cheryl's personal life section to dating One Direction singer Liam Payne as of February 2016 as confirmed by Liam Payne's instagram account @fakeliampayne Max cheryl123 (talk) 22:04, 28 February 2016 (UTC)

Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. Mz7 (talk) 22:30, 28 February 2016 (UTC)

• Max cheryl123 - Just so you're aware - It was decided above that this shouldn't be moved and quite rightly so, We're not gonna keep moving the article everytime she gets married and then divorced, Not our problem if she can't stay with one man. –Davey2010 23:16, 28 February 2016 (UTC)

This is evidently a rumour that got going after Payne posted a picture of them together on his Instagram page (check out Liam Payne fuels rumours of romance with Cheryl Fernandez-Versini from The Guardian; oh, and note they are still calling her Fernandez-Versini). I am constantly amused by those who believe social media to be the fountain of all knowledge. This is Paul (talk) 23:25, 28 February 2016 (UTC)

Unfortunately This is Paul todays generation is fucked beyond all hope...., Alls I can say is I'm glad I wasn't born in this decade!. , –Davey2010 23:44, 28 February 2016 (UTC)

This generation is fucked beyond all hope? Not all of them. Cheryl is though.185.80.220.181 (talk) 13:30, 8 March 2016 (UTC) 78.151.26.72 (talk) 20:53, 27 April 2016 (UTC)

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Fansite

This article is just a fansite for Cheryl. 78.151.26.72 (talk) 20:45, 27 April 2016 (UTC)

Change of name 3

LBC's Steve Allen says that she now wishes to be know as the single name "Cheryl".78.151.24.27 (talk) 04:48, 21 April 2016 (UTC)

• She can call herself Gertrude all for I care - Article's staying as it is. –Davey2010 16:56, 21 April 2016 (UTC)
  • Seeing as she changes her name every 5 minutes, it's not going to affect this article any time soon. anemoneprojectors 09:33, 22 April 2016 (UTC)

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