Misplaced Pages

Revision as of 00:55, 27 August 2008

Please stay calm and civil while commenting or presenting evidence, and do not make personal attacks. Be patient when approaching solutions to any issues. If consensus is not reached, other solutions exist to draw attention and ensure that more editors mediate or comment on the dispute.

This is Jimbo Wales's talk page, where you can send them messages and comments.

Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic. New to Misplaced Pages? Welcome! Learn to edit; get help. Assume good faith Be polite and avoid personal attacks Be welcoming to newcomers Seek dispute resolution if needed

Archives: Index, Index, A, B, C, D, E, F, G, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37, 38, 39, 40, 41, 42, 43, 44, 45, 46, 47, 48, 49, 50, 51, 52, 53, 54, 55, 56, 57, 58, 59, 60, 61, 62, 63, 64, 65, 66, 67, 68, 69, 70, 71, 72, 73, 74, 75, 76, 77, 78, 79, 80, 81, 82, 83, 84, 85, 86, 87, 88, 89, 90, 91, 92, 93, 94, 95, 96, 97, 98, 99, 100, 101, 102, 103, 104, 105, 106, 107, 108, 109, 110, 111, 112, 113, 114, 115, 116, 117, 118, 119, 120, 121, 122, 123, 124, 125, 126, 127, 128, 129, 130, 131, 132, 133, 134, 135, 136, 137, 138, 139, 140, 141, 142, 143, 144, 145, 146, 147, 148, 149, 150, 151, 152, 153, 154, 155, 156, 157, 158, 159, 160, 161, 162, 163, 164, 165, 166, 167, 168, 169, 170, 171, 172, 173, 174, 175, 176, 177, 178, 179, 180, 181, 182, 183, 184, 185, 186, 187, 188, 189, 190, 191, 192, 193, 194, 195, 196, 197, 198, 199, 200, 201, 202, 203, 204, 205, 206, 207, 208, 209, 210, 211, 212, 213, 214, 215, 216, 217, 218, 219, 220, 221, 222, 223, 224, 225, 226, 227, 228, 229, 230, 231, 232, 233, 234, 235, 236, 237, 238, 239, 240, 241, 242, 243, 244, 245, 246, 247, 248, 249, 250, 251, 252Auto-archiving period: 2 days

Archives

Index -index- As of January 16, 2003 September – December 2005 January 2006 January – February 2006 February 2006 February 2006, cont. March 2006 April 2006 - late May 2006 May 24 - July 2006 July 2006 - August 2006 August 2006 Most of September 2006 Late September 2006 - Early November 2006 Most of November 2006 Late November 2006 - December 8, 2006 December 9, 2006 - Mid January 2007 From December 22, 2006 blanking Mid January 2007 - Mid February 2007 Mid February 2007- Feb 25, 2007 From March 2, 2007 blanking March 2-5, 2007 March 5-11, 2007 March 11 - April 3, 2007 April 2 - May 2, 2007 May 3 - June 7, 2007 June 9 - July 4, 2007 July 13 - August 17, 2007 August 17 - September 11, 2007 September 14 - October 7, 2007 October 28 - December 1, 2007 December 2 - December 16, 2007 December 15 - January 4, 2008 January 4 - January 30, 2008 January 30 - February 28, 2008 February 28 - March 11, 2008 March 9 - April 18, 2008 April 18 - May 30, 2008 May 30 - July 27, 2008 July 26 - October 4, 2008 October 4 - November 12, 2008 November 10 - December 10, 2008 December 5 - December 25, 2008 December 25 - January 16, 2009 January 15 - January 27, 2009 January 26 - February 10, 2009 February 8 - March 18, 2009 March 18 - May 6, 2009 May 5 - June 9, 2009 June 10 - July 11, 2009 July 12 - August 29, 2009

This page has archives. Sections older than 2 days may be automatically archived by Lowercase sigmabot III.

Recent hijacking of wikipedia?

Yesterday I was using wikipedia, and searched "Ebay" on the searchbar on wikipedia, but redirected me to a horribly mutiliated wikipedia page (with the wiki logo on top left, search bar (with nothing else), dark blue background), with the message: "This is the Zodiac speaking. Do you still think you can stop me? Do you still think I have a soul? I do know that you people do not have souls, for I have destroyed them." Below this message was a bunch of numbers, which appears to be a coded message (highly likely as this person calls himself the zodiac), along with the image "CelticCross.svg" from wikipedia Commons in the bottom. Although I constantly tried to go into the Ebay page, this page kept opening, until a few minutes later the wikipedia page I wanted opened. I do not think this should go unnoticed, as you can still find the affected wiki-pages if you google search the message above, which is from the pages affected. This list of pages seems to change over a period of time I am not sure of. The most recent articles affected are: Ebay, List of Playstation 2 Games, Vallfogona de Riucorb, Space Race, Cookie Monster, Akita Inu, Bloodhound, OAO TMK, Honduras, International Superhits!, Final Fight.

I hope I have been a help alerting wikipedia of this problem. JustShin (talk) 09:48, 23 August 2008 (UTC)

Admins are aware of this and deal with it as it occurs. Thanks for letting us know. --Rodhullandemu 13:41, 23 August 2008 (UTC)

Steve Crossin, PeterSymonds (Admin) ChetBlong (Admin) and account sharing.

Jimbo, dont stick your head in the sand pretending you are aware of it ;-). I would like your opinion on the matter see here   «l| Ψrom3th3ăn ™|l»  (talk) 13:35, 23 August 2008 (UTC)

Well of course I keep an eye on all this sort of thing, so I have been involved in talking with the ArbCom about it. It's a strange case, and disappointing. The one piece of the puzzle that I still don't get is *why* or what the point of it was. I mean, nothing untoward seemed to be going on. Just routine stuff. (At least as far as I know.) So... whatever. Poor judgment.--Jimbo Wales (talk) 01:26, 24 August 2008 (UTC)

Request for copyright permission

I am requesting permission to use the following image: wmf:Image:Wiki.png on my blog. All content is about the foundation and its projects (mainly Misplaced Pages) and the logo would be used in the position it is currently.

I would happily remove the image or amend the copyright notice at the bottom. Please notify me on my talk page when you reply (although this page is on my watchlist, I often miss changes). Thank you very much for your time Mr. Wales Dendodge|Talk 09:22, 24 August 2008 (UTC)

I would also move the logo to a different position, at your request Dendodge|Talk 09:30, 24 August 2008 (UTC)

Actually, it is more of a trademark issue than a copyright issue. It is about branding and making money from deals the Foundation is now making with billion dollar corporations. The Foundation people need to make this sort of decision. I am aware that we have been liberal in the past in this regard, but the Foundation is getting more and more professional and creating complex strategies for maximizing income from its brand. I know that doesn't answer your question, but the point is that this is not Jimbo's decision to make. He does not own Misplaced Pages or the Foundation or its assets like its trademarks. He can't give you something owned by another. You do have Fair use so far as copyright claims go, but I don't think that covers your intended use. The point of trademark law is to ensure people are not mislead. Your intended use could cause some people to think there was an official relationship between the Foundation and your blog. So this is probably a bad idea. WAS 4.250 (talk) 15:31, 24 August 2008 (UTC)

"deals the Foundation is now making with billion dollar corporations"? Could anyone elaborate on this? I hope their strategies for spending income wisely are at least as complex and well thought-out as their strategies for maximizing it.

Dendodge: Since they're simply using trademark law to avoid frauds from passing off (pretending to be Misplaced Pages), I don't think they'll mind if you use the logo provided that there is a visible disclaimer, "This website is not affiliated with the Wikimedia Foundation". The reason is because your blog would be made in order to promote Misplaced Pages, which benefits them.

Similarly, when Bungie Studios heard about Red Vs. Blue, although technically Red Vs. Blue violated Bungie's intellectual property, Bungie didn't sue them. Bungie supported Red Vs. Blue, because it helped to promote their game series. How it impacts Misplaced Pages financially is a part of fair use and, in this case, there doesn't seem to be any actual harm. Provided that it's clear you're not an official site or affiliated with the Foundation, using the logo is harmless. ☯  Zenwhat (talk) 16:10, 24 August 2008 (UTC)

That sounds about right. He has a fair use right to say "This is Wikimedia's logo" and show it, so that takes care of copyright law infringement. And very clearly saying "This site is not an official site or affiliated with the Foundation." takes care of trademark law infringement. (I am not a lawyer and this is not legal advice :) ) Zenwhat, take a look at Wikimedia Foundation's Executive Director's latest report to the Board of Trustees. Also see http://wikimediafoundation.org/User:Kwadhwa. He is the guy responsible for turning our brand and trademarks into money and deals that advance the Foundation goals. WAS 4.250 (talk) 16:24, 24 August 2008 (UTC)

That's what I thought. I wasn't sure if any trademark existed, which is why I referred to copyright, and I couldn't be bothered to send an email to a mailing list and wait days for a reply so I simply asked Jimbo. Dendodge|Talk 16:14, 24 August 2008 (UTC)

Jimbo is not responcible for manageing the foundation's intellectual property. He cannot legaly give you permission.Geni 16:34, 24 August 2008 (UTC)

Jimbo is still in the Board, though, and can forward the request to whomever is responsible for this sort of thing. Titoxd 19:15, 24 August 2008 (UTC)

That's why I asked him - I should maybe have mentioned the board (I thought I did, but...) Dendodge|Talk 19:24, 24 August 2008 (UTC)

You said "I couldn't be bothered to send an email to a mailing list and wait days for a reply so I simply asked Jimbo" and " why I asked him". WAS 4.250 (talk) 23:39, 25 August 2008 (UTC)

Ok, well, as several people have pointed out now :-), this is the sort of thing that should be handled by the Foundation office, not by me personally. Please email Mike Godwin.--Jimbo Wales (talk) 13:53, 26 August 2008 (UTC)

Informing you of a grounds of user banning

In would like to strongly request that you review the current situation of Fasach Nua . I am hereby officially filing a complaint against him. I am amongst the only users who has noticed him completely, and luckily so because it is becoming evident that he is deliberately ruining the process of Misplaced Pages.

First and foremost, he is blatantly disrupting the Featured Article candidates process. He seems to have developed a hatred for me and has deliberately opposed my nominated articles on inappropriate grounds. This is resulting in a nomination process turning into an unnecessary and unfriendly argument; solely due to his sparking. His main issue seems to be with image use. He has proven that his personal criteria for image use cannot be satisfied. Misplaced Pages:Non-free content review will show such. His section titled 'These Logos' started his issue. He is arguing that national flags can be used to replace the copyrighted national logos of a sports team. The section on that page clearly shows he has been opposed by almost everyone present, and his other mentions at different places have also been strongly ignored and opposed. Yet despite such, he goes around raising the issue wherever he can; he has once again found himself Misplaced Pages:Featured article candidates/Croatia national football team|at my nomination for Featured Article]] and raised it again. He was opposed as usual but still went on to oppose the FA candidate. After I attempted to resolve his argument, he kept mentioning the same issue and ignored all replies to him. He then went on to oppose the candidate again due to another one of his crazy issues which was also clearly resolved, yet ignored by him.

I think ruining the FA decision process is clear grounds for a ban: or at least some kind of block from his account making edits to any further FA candidate pages. His crazy arguments are turning all pages into an unnecessary argument which keeps feuding. Even after they have been resolved, he brings the issue up again. He is blatantly ruining some very significant talk pages in a deliberate attack on me and some other users. You should really review such and issue a warning/block/suspension or ban to him. Anyone will tell you he is clearly walking on grounds for such. Thanks! Domiy (talk) 11:12, 26 August 2008 (UTC)

Hi, thanks for your note, but appealing to me is really the last stage of the dispute resolution process. If he's being really disruptive then any admin can hand out a short block, otherwise you could bring the matter to a more formal process.--Jimbo Wales (talk) 13:46, 26 August 2008 (UTC)

Article voting in the German Misplaced Pages

Yesterday, a new feature was implemented in the German Misplaced Pages. It allows IP users and users without "sighting rights" (that is to flag articles as vandalism free) to vote for the quality of articles. This is done in the form of a box below the article. Users can vote for the reliability, completeness, neutrality and presentation on a school note scheme from "insufficient" to "very good".

Why was this feature implemented without a previous discussion of the authors of the German Misplaced Pages? Almost nobdoy even know about this feature before it went live yesterday night. Currently, there is a "Meinungsbild" (popular vote) if the authors want the feature to go on or not. Currently, there are 40 for the feature, 121 against it and 21 who don't think that this "Meinungsbild" is a good idea (for various reasons). A "Meinungsbild" is widely regarded as the definitive measure to settle side-wide formal and technical disputes in the German Misplaced Pages. --Novil Ariandis (talk) 11:15, 26 August 2008 (UTC)

I have no idea. I was not aware of it at all.--Jimbo Wales (talk) 13:47, 26 August 2008 (UTC)

is it the new Foundation/Developer/whose ever policy to use German Misplaced Pages as a guinea pig for new experiments without saying us a word about it? The community on de.wp isn't very happy about that...TheWolf (talk) 16:10, 26 August 2008 (UTC)

Comment please

There is a bit of an arguement going on about an admin's deletion of images whilst they were nominated for deletion and the issue was being discussed.

The discussion about the admin's actions can be found at WP:ANI (User:Future Perfect at Sunrise; inappropriate deletions?), and the discussion about the deletion of one of the images can be found here (Chillenden one - It is an image I uploaded, acknowledging it is a copyright image, appropriately attributed and with what I believe to be a valid fair use rationale). Would you please take a look as it seems to me that a lot of arguement is going on without anything getting settled one way or the other. Mjroots (talk) 12:43, 26 August 2008 (UTC)

I don't normally get involved at the level of detail of individual image or article deletions, I am more interested in the broad improvement of policies and process. In this case, it looks like the process is working well. I actually agree with the deletion, but that's not really my point. My point is that it looks like the process of AfD and Deletion Review is working here.--Jimbo Wales (talk) 13:51, 26 August 2008 (UTC)

OK, thanks for your time. I've still got more to learn about Misplaced Pages and how it works. I try not to get into disputes etc. but I feel the Chillenden Windmill article is poorer without the image. Am trying to source an image that is not from a Press Agency in the hope that it will be allowed to be kept. 15:29, 26 August 2008 (UTC)

Mr Wales

I sent an email to you about interviewing you via email. I recieved an email back from Sierra but when I replied didnt hear anything back. Can you please confirm if you have seen this email or have heard about it? BountyHunter2008 (talk) 14:44, 26 August 2008 (UTC)

Adminship of user:ChrisO

I'd like to question the adminship of user:ChrisO. This after arrogant behaviour concerning this template, such as pushing controversial edits through while ignoring discussion, using page protection tactically to consolidate his own edits and changing policy for specific purposes. In my view he is using his adminship to further his political views. . --83.249.240.108 (talk) 21:48, 26 August 2008 (UTC)

Just so you're aware, Jimbo doesn't go around desysopping people just for the hell of it. If you have a legitimate complaint against an admin, bring it up on WP:ANI, not here. J.delanoy_adds 00:12, 27 August 2008 (UTC)

It appears to be true that ChrisO misused admin tools, by protecting (and unprotecting) the page in February 2008 and April 2008, but I have seen no recent abuse of tools on Template:Countries of Europe, and ChrisO hasn't even edited the template since April (though he is still active on the talkpage). Asking Jimbo to de-sysop, based on something that happened a few months ago, seems a bit extreme, not to mention that Jimbo prefers that the community handles these kinds of situations (except in very very rare cases such as with the de-sysopping of User:Bedford). I do agree that ChrisO should not have been using tools at that template though, since he was not an uninvolved admin. Other than that, this issue is fairly stale. If there are other cases of ChrisO abusing tools, the best way to handle it is to bring them up (with diffs) at his talkpage. If the problems continue, a thread at WP:ANI or a Request for Comment would be the proper way to proceed. If there was community consensus that ChrisO had abused tools, he could choose to resign, or, as a last resort, the community could request de-sysopping via the Arbitration Committee. --Elonka 00:55, 27 August 2008 (UTC)