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Table

Shouldn't the Narration Chart of 24 Tirathankars table be split so it can be seen convineiently?--Redtigerxyz (talk) 07:14, 7 December 2007 (UTC)

I think it must be —Preceding unsigned comment added by 59.95.219.155 (talk) 04:55, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Requested move

The request to rename this article to Tirthankara has been carried out. If the page title has consensus, be sure to close this discussion using {{subst:RM top|'''page moved'''.}} and {{subst:RM bottom}} and remove the {{Requested move/dated|…}} tag, or replace it with the {{subst:Requested move/end|…}} tag.

Tirthankar → Tirthankara – Standard title. Proper IAST usage as used in academic sources Arjun 11:40, 19 July 2011 (UTC)

• Support on grounds of consistency. We already have Mahavira. Fowler&fowler«Talk» 08:25, 24 July 2011 (UTC)

• Support - reason:proper IAST usage. ..असक्तः सततं कार्य कर्म समाचर | असक्तः हि आचरन् कर्म.. Humour Thisthat2011 08:58, 24 July 2011 (UTC)

• Support - Per nom. I am surprised this is not already at "Tirthankara"--Sodabottle (talk) 09:05, 24 July 2011 (UTC)
• Oppose: tirthankar beats tirthankara 3:1Yogesh Khandke (talk) 09:46, 24 July 2011 (UTC)

Well, "Mahavir" also definitely beats "Mahavira" in Google Hits. AFAIK, Many Indian languages (like Hindi) shun the ending "-a" sound of Sanskrit; and the speakers of the languages dominate India in number. Same as "Ram" for Rama in Northern India. I guess we need to stick with the proper Sanskrit transliteration. Arjun 12:13, 24 July 2011 (UTC)

It is तीर्थंकर in Sanskrit and not तीर्थंकरा , giving it the extra a would make it sound like the later, which it isn't, neither in Sanskrit, nor Maharashtri Prakrit, the language of the Jain texts. See, we have a system of Romanisation, it is how names are prefered to be written by Indians, like your user name Arjun अर्जुन , do you use Arjuna??? or myself Yogesha??? Don't Romanise on the whims of etic sources. See the Chinese system. When we went to school we spelt the fellow Heun Sang, now the Misplaced Pages title is Xuanzang, the Chinese prefer it to spell it that way. They are happy I am happy. Yogesh Khandke (talk) 17:26, 24 July 2011 (UTC)

Check this out, I used तीर्थंकर and तीर्थंकरा 22k former only 6 later.Yogesh Khandke (talk) 17:42, 24 July 2011 (UTC)

Indians use English in day to day use, Indians spell proper names, ie they Romanise. An international committee shouldn't tell us how to write our names in a language we are familiar with. Was IATA or whatever consulted when Mumbai, or Kolkata or Bengalaru, proper nouns in three different Indian languages were Romanised???Yogesh Khandke (talk) 17:49, 24 July 2011 (UTC)

If i am not mistaken, your search results on certain "Devanagiri strings" are returning Hindi results. Sanskrit is a language without a native script, so we need to stick to the proper IAST usage, whatever it is. When you say that "it is how names are preferred to be written by Indians" you are infact pointing to what is preferred by the Hindi-speaking population and others' whose native language shuns the ending "-a". My proposal to move the page was based on my assumption that IAST form would be "Tirthankara". I had referred with another user is a regular with Jainism articles (link) who told me that "Tirthankara" was the IAST. If the IAST is "Tirthankar" i will rest my case, else we must go with "Tirthankara". I couldn't find an online IAST source, can anyone? Arjun 19:33, 24 July 2011 (UTC)

BTW in my school, i was taught Jainism has 24 Tirthankaras. Arjun 19:35, 24 July 2011 (UTC)

(1) No dear Mumbai, Kolkata and Bengalaru aint Hindi. (2)And whoever said Sanskrit is without a native script??? All you can say with accuracy is that it doesn't have a unique script used over the many thousands of years it has been used. (3) Isn't Tirthankar Maharashtri Prakrit?? Thisthat you are the expert here??? (4)The google search, I didn't doctor it, the text string is in Devnagri, so it returned Devnagri results. (5)Devnagari is used by many languages, Marathi, Hindi, Sanskrit (official see the script used on bank notes), Nepali, Bhojpuri, Kokani, and even Roma, perhaps also Pali and Ardha Magadhi (6)My logic is simple, if Arjun spells his name Arjun (emic use) a committee shouldn't change it to Bskvm. (7)If Misplaced Pages Romanises Chinese proper names the way they Romanise it, there should be no reason why India should be treated differently. Don't duck this point. (8)Don't take committees too seriously, we are writing English and not Newspeak, look at Ghoti, don't take English too seriously, and please don't whine about Hindi, it is irrelevant. Yogesh Khandke (talk) 16:51, 25 July 2011 (UTC)

My point is simple. There is no standard way "how names are preferred to be written by Indians". The closest is the IAST. Arjun 04:36, 26 July 2011 (UTC)

(1)Ya India doesn't have a standard Romanisation like pinyin, the official system which if you don't follow, are thrown into jail, and are there until all your organs are removed to be sold and you die. (2)But India does have a popular way in which a name is spelt, like Arjun is. I have given evidence that Tirthankar is more popular than Tirthankara. (3) So freedom is India's undoing.Yogesh Khandke (talk) 15:07, 26 July 2011 (UTC)

• Support The IAST transliteration is "Tīrthaṃkara". Google scholar however has less entries for "Tīrthaṃkara" and the diacritics less "Tirthankara" compared to "Tirthankar". But it's reversed on Google books where the traditional Sanskrit rendering is a lot more common. Part of the issue on scholar appears to be multiple published people with the name "Tirthankar" as opposed to articles about Tirthankara/Tirthankar. Since diacritics use isn't very common in scholarly discussion of the topic, a move to "Tirthankara" is fine. —SpacemanSpiff 09:22, 26 July 2011 (UTC)

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