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*{{Re|Davey2010}} I don't think your comment warranted an apology, but thanks anyway. And be sure, what I wrote in the email was ''only'' meant as a friendly FYI in case you had missed it. Nothing "Now listen up, lad .." was intended. :) Cheers, '''] ]''' 08:30, 18 May 2016 (UTC)
*{{Re|Davey2010}} I don't think your comment warranted an apology, but thanks anyway. And be sure, what I wrote in the email was ''only'' meant as a friendly FYI in case you had missed it. Nothing "Now listen up, lad .." was intended. :) Cheers, '''] ]''' 08:30, 18 May 2016 (UTC)
::Hi Sam, It did - I pretty much had a go at you for you simply giving me advice and I'll be honest I was out of order,
::Anyway no worries, I know and that's how I perceived it and I do greatly appreciate you giving me a little heads up there :),
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Agent's address.
I was just fishing for an admission. It's fairly clear COI-- I mean, who puts the actual agent's address, with street and suite number in the lede? Hilarious. I deleted most of the content in any case, as it was a copyvio. HappyValleyEditor (talk) 05:07, 23 April 2016 (UTC)
To editor HappyValleyEditor: As long as the shipping company insists on a 15-year old mantra that everybody on the pier can jump onboard and start pulling ropes and churning winches without any training, this is the kind of ship you get: manned by an army of unpaid deckhands that try to teach the landlubbers, and constantly are running around politely pointing out that pissing against the wind is a no-no and that the poop deck is not for taking a dump.
If main space at times can be hilarious, try joining the ranks over at AfC. CAT:GFOO for the latest submissions. If you want to actively review, I recommend using Yet Another Articles for Creation Helper Script by enabling Preferences → Gadgets → Editing → Yet Another AFC Helper Script. The blatant promo, the blatant copy-vios, the blatant non-significant subjects you get immune to. They are much less of a problem than the many, many well written drafts with a long list of references that tries to make a borderline subject pass the threshold of notability. Catch you around, Sam Sailor13:14, 23 April 2016 (UTC)
Thank you for the kind advice! Now I understand the quote at the top of your user page. (BTW, I see him on the street every five years or so-- he has a house up the street from me. He always looks like any other neighbourhood sailor.) HappyValleyEditor (talk) 23:39, 23 April 2016 (UTC)
Thank you, HappyValleyEditor, for that wonderful picture: A fedora comes walking down the street with the old poet underneath. He hums "I'm turning tricks, I'm getting fixed, I'm back on boogie street". Sam Sailor11:09, 24 April 2016 (UTC)
F1 IP editor
Hello, I thought it best to bring the discussion here rather than the req. page as I might go on a bit. It wouldn't be too bad if the re-directs were created as I, or another member of the F1 project, would add 'hidden' advice to the source that the article should not be created without first discussing at the F1 project. (As has been done in several other instances). This seems to be enough to dissuade our over-enthusiastic friend. Just by way of background, he has made multiple requests for redirects for cars which fail notability and then created (or tried to) poor quality articles from them. See also discussion here. This is just one of the issues the project has with this editor, who has been disrupting F1 articles for about 8 months now. Anyway, whatever you decide to do with the requests is probably OK in the long run. Thanks. Regards, Eagleash (talk) 15:02, 23 April 2016 (UTC)
@Eagleash: Both redirects are reasonable, as they are mentioned in the target, but the concerns your background knowledge raises are valid. If I go and create the redirects, and you post a {{Pinggroup}} here to other F1-project participants, e.g.
There's at least 3 F1 editors who are constantly vigilant for IP's activity (one, at least, has almost every F1 page watchlisted!) So if the re-dirs are accepted, it's fine, we'll cover it. And I will immediately watchlist the re-dirs., although the 'pinggroup' idea is a good one. The cars aren't notable in any way as they are actually Formula 2 cars which 'made up the numbers' in (from memory) one F1 race each and achieved nothing of note. Thanks. Eagleash (talk) 15:31, 23 April 2016 (UTC)
G13 Eligibility Notice
Collapsed
The following pages will become eligible for CSD:G13 shortly.
I discovered there's also a draft here which I have nominated at MfD here (although in hindsight I suppose it could have been bundled at AfD). Good work on this stuff! Eagleash (talk) 15:55, 24 April 2016 (UTC)
Responded at the appropriate venue. Good find. I got tired of sifting through their contribs and took a break. All edits - incl. those logged out as 78.145.17.94 (talk·contribs·WHOIS) - have been towards building this hoax. Sam Sailor16:03, 24 April 2016 (UTC)
@Eagleash: Def qualifies for a block, but I was contemplating another route, that would maybe save the brave editors at ANI for this case.
Knowing1900 (SUL) also made a disruptive edit on itwiki (I have reverted). From working cross-wiki with the case José Rafael Cordero Sánchez I recall a steward who's also an admin on itwiki. Since this case involves creating a hoax about something Italian, I'd assume he would globally lock the account if made aware of the matter. But I am open to other suggestions, what do you think? Sam Sailor09:07, 25 April 2016 (UTC)
Apologies, delay, RL is a so & so right now. TBH I don't really know enough about how blocking procedures etc. work. I'd just plonk what I could remember at ANI & hope for the best! The fact that the ed. has not attempted to defend their 'work' says it all though. So really I'm no help at all, sorry! Eagleash (talk) 23:31, 25 April 2016 (UTC)
@Eagleash: Apologies not needed, as you see from my own delay I've been procrastinating myself, but as Knowing1900 and the IP stopped, it is not an urgent matter. I posted a message to this steward; if for any reasons he does not globally lock, we'll file at ANI, it's a two liner with a block proposition. Catch you around, Sam Sailor12:26, 27 April 2016 (UTC)
I imagine you have it watchlisted...but just in case...the article is being (badly) edited again by a different account. Eagleash (talk) 23:59, 27 April 2016 (UTC)
@Eagleash: Yeah, did notice. Not exactly Hemingway. And what's with the inline URLs to redlinked titles on Simple? I checked their global contribs, Special:CentralAuth/Coralsnan, they have been around Simple, but have not edited. Bartoli family says that "the younger son Fabio Bartoli resides in London". The IP is from London, I believe. Will you file at SPI? Did you check out Volterra? A regular has left in a part of the hoax without fact-checking it. I've been answering on their talk this morning. Peculiar case of denial any mistakes, despite being reverted by two editors. Find it in my contribs. ... Do you have or have you had teen kids? Just thinking aloud, no need to answer. YKWIM. TTYL, Sam Sailor08:49, 28 April 2016 (UTC)
@Eagleash: It's been a long day in RL. I'm working on an ANI post regarding the Bartoli affair. Would that be OK with you? (Does the ECHO work here?? Gonna post you a TB.) Sam Sailor22:36, 28 April 2016 (UTC)
I'm fine with an ANI post. I was mulling it over myself, as well as poss SPI, the second account doesn't seem to have edited further. I looked at the talk-page discussion you mentioned...couldn't really follow the other ed's. logic. No to teenagers...other peoples are enough of a pain! I got TB and a notification so everything seems to be working.
On another note a strange thing happened a day or two ago. A page (now deleted as a copy-vio of this) was having maintenance templates removed by two accounts both with Sunny Li in the name. I reverted. Both accounts ended up at AIV (1 blocked) but the next morning I got a friend request on Facebook from 'Sunny Li'; haven't accepted. Eagleash (talk) 22:58, 28 April 2016 (UTC)
@Eagleash: And next thing you know is they ask for a money transfer for their sick aunt. ;) "Life replicates bad television." I'm going to get that ANI report finished. You'll get a notification. Cheers mate, Sam Sailor23:04, 28 April 2016 (UTC)
Haha; maybe...her FB doesn't have the hallmarks of a scam type page. Thanks for the ANI notification: by the time I got to it, it had been closed. All done and dusted then. Also noted that the post after yours was about a reviewer who the F1 project have long had (serious) reservations about...accepting multiple sub-standard drafts by our IP-hopping, re-direct-requesting, disruptive editor mentioned above. Regards, Eagleash (talk) 04:39, 29 April 2016 (UTC)
@Eagleash: FB: "Her"? You're sure? I had a chat experience were it was impossible to get "her" on Skype. To this day a buddy of mine keeps poking me saying "You're sure she was a 26-year old Norwegian med student interested in your boat, not a 65-year old man interested in something else, or just anybody manipulating you?" He's got a point, doesn't he? I'm glad I dropped that chat relatively quickly; hopefully it attests to some degree of sanity.
ANI: Good to notice that Cavarrone brings up ST at AfD in the current ANI thread. Yesterday he !voted (or maybe "voted" is the better word here?) at 68 AfDs, since 20 April he has voted at 500+. His arguments are mostly generalized, seldom does he cite specific notability guidelines. The dilemma is that his AfD stats (although with a low 6% keep) shows a high correct rate of 90+%. Did someone ever look at the degree of pile-on votes? Ex. Diff of Misplaced Pages:Articles for deletion/Finrod Felagund - 06:02:44 and then 17 (!) seconds later in Diff of Misplaced Pages:Articles for deletion/Bageshwari (magazine) - 06:03:01 as third delete !vote. I see lots of <1 min between votes. He's not section editing, he's opening a new window or tab.
In regards to curation of F1 articles, why not make a proposal on WT:F1 that ST be requested to skip curation of F1 related articles? Sam Sailor19:06, 29 April 2016 (UTC)
It has been mooted before that ST be asked not to 'review' F1 articles. I'm keeping out of the discussion a bit for various reasons. It's always possible that Sunny Li is an imposter. However the FB page has a good number of pics in various situations not just say one blurry smiley shot... still haven't accepted though. Boat... of course... sailor...haha. Many many years ago now I worked for a quite well-known yacht chandler in Piccadilly, London. (The bigger boats played havoc with the traffic!) On another note someone just asked my opinion of this. I think it's borderline and needs some work if it is to be kept, but they are wondering if it should go to AfD. Got a lot of refs though but not in English. Any thoughts? (If you can spare the time). Thanks. Eagleash (talk) 21:58, 30 April 2016 (UTC)
Ha, you worked in a chandlery? FB: Go for it. F1: The project gets what the consensus wants. Taneli Tikka: first impression: slick as teflon. History: 1 major editor. Look him up: disclosed paid editor. Finnish w/o a doubt. Also "custodian" of the same article on sv.wiki and fi.wiki. Sv.wiki has a maintenance template saying "looks like a press release, make less promotional, may not be notable". An Sv admin has been editing. (PersPOV: The smaller Wikis are often editor strapped, so the presence of an article in the original language may indicate at least some notability, but can mean that nobody had time to delete.) That's my first impression. I don't speak Finnish, so a thorough evaluation of the sources would take some time. I hope I'm not the only one that finds that a sentence like "Tikka is married and has two cats." has 8 legs too many. You could post a message to Widr and/or Tappinen they are the Finnish editors I can recall. Cheers, Sam Sailor23:57, 30 April 2016 (UTC)
I had a look at the Finnish Taneli Tikka page, references are made to major national business newspapers and the few which I evaluated were OK. Usually, we do not question notability of someone who got such a large media visibility when it is not related to one event but several, as it is in this case. You can see from the talk page of the English page that "jjanhone (talk · contribs) has been paid by Tieto on behalf of Taneli Tikka."; jjanhone is a well-known editor in fi-wiki, and she knows the rules. Cheers, --Tappinen (talk) 04:33, 1 May 2016 (UTC)
Help on rebranding issue for Flixbus & Flixmobility
Hi Sam Sailor, I wanted to thank you shortly for your prompt help (hope this is the right place to do it).
I will try now to continue the discussion there.
Thanks again,
Francesco — Preceding unsigned comment added by Fc2016 (talk • contribs) 12:31, 27 April 2016 (UTC)
Volterra and Bartoli family
Hi Sam. I had a look on Bartoli family and I think that not only is unsourced but it seems completely invented. I will do quicky some further searches. On Volterra's article, as soon as possible, I will try to improve it. --Chiorbone da Frittole (talk) 18:00, 27 April 2016 (UTC)
Dear Sam Sailor, here I'm. After looking on the many ways to get things moving forward in a positive way for the article to be kept: not really sure about the best option. In your view what can be done to enter the process to get the issue potentially resolved knowing that the page nominator stays silent? Could you indicate page leads on what can be done at this stage. Again thank you. Best,
--Mateouso (talk) 06:57, 30 April 2016 (UTC)
@Mateouso: Bonsoir Mateouso. In short: don't worry. The Story of O - Chapter 2 will not be deleted. Even at the time of nomination for deletion, it had enough references to meet WP:NF. EditorE makes a call for an early close, and I myself find these nominations are a waste of community time. But I do not see evidence that this could be closed pursuant to WP:SKCRIT #2. MichaelQSchmidt makes a remark regarding noms argument Does not deserve its own article which is a WP:JUSTNOTNOTABLE-argument that should be avoided. It is, IMHO, bordering to being so weak that WP:SKCRIT #1 could be used for closure, but it is not a crystal clear case. So it is unlikely we will see a Speedy Keep closure. An early close as Snow Keep is a theoretical possibility but slim (I'll spare you the details and the caveats) ... anyways, I have voiced my opinion in the discussion, and thus should not close it, and as we are now only two days away from the 7 days the discussion is set to run, why not just kick back and relax. Yes, it looks horrible with that AfD box on one's work, but it will soon be over and forgotten. I'll close the {{Help me}} on your user talk page. Let me know if there's anything else I can do. Cordialement, Sam Sailor15:39, 30 April 2016 (UTC)
A7
Hi,
I noticed your discussion here. I take it that you agree with my tag removal? I've been told by some people that I have the right idea about what constitutes a credible claim of significance. Others have told me that my idea is way off most people's. Some editors are in-between. One person even thinks I'm dangerous to Misplaced Pages and shouldn't be allowed to touch CSD with a bargepole because I keep going against "consensus". What consensus? Opinions are all over the place, and some editors simply do not understand significance properly. I was actually half-expecting the A7 tag to be restored, if not by the original nominator then by someone else. Given this confusion, I'd like to know where you stand on A7, because it's far too controversial if you ask me. Thanks. Adam9007 (talk) 00:38, 1 May 2016 (UTC)
Thanks for dropping by. Are we specifically talking Stefun Jahangir Carzon? Then I can not give an opinion, as it has been deleted for a second time pursuant to A7. I have no opinion on your work as I have not looked into it. Amongst the many clever and kind people here are those that will judge you, sometimes in a less than clever and kind way. Don't take their rants personally. But I did today send you a friendly thought when I saw you removed User:Velella's mistaken A7 from Evergreen Packaging. Well done. I just found your A7 hastiness post on WT:CSD. Personally I'd prefer if the bar was set higher for new creations for non-extended autoconfirmed. Main space is indexed. Draft space is not. Put new creations there, train more hands to review at AFC instead of NPP. But this kind of discussions have been going on for years. As for mainspace, I can't see why A7 should not have the same 15 min grace period. We have a two-liner on a young singer/actor/whatever for 2 min in main space or for 15 min, no big deal. But you are right, some people misunderstand A7. Velella is one, and we should try to help them understand, if we can. Cheers, Sam Sailor01:55, 1 May 2016 (UTC)
I was actually talking about Thiel Audio. I removed the A7 tag from Evergreen Packaging because WP:CSD states "A page is eligible for speedy deletion only if all of its revisions are also eligible", and previous revisions did assert significance. It's not just CCS I encounter problems with, it's the scope too. For example, I don't recall the community deciding to include computer programs in A7, or class them as businesses (which is rather ironic and hypocritical if you get my drift...) and I think the history speaks for itself here. I think there's talk about making NPP a right, because far too often people with limited or no knowledge go there and do such erroneous taggings. Adam9007 (talk) 02:42, 1 May 2016 (UTC)
Thiel: If you as much as consider PRODing this previous revision of Thiel Audio, you have a lot to learn. If you actually smack a {{db-corp}} on it, you can't, IMHO, come much closer to shouting "I have no clue about CSD#A7". (The article has other issues; basically all the SPA promo needs to be cut out, and it needs referencing.) I had previously templated the tagger in regards to similar cases, so I chose to start a dialogue; after his first habitual answer, he did not respond.
Evergreen: Again, we are miles away from CSD territory.
Software is an ABCS. AlbumsBooksCreative_worksSoftware. ABCS are exempted from A7. Easy to remember, you should think. I PRODed a book stub once. Minutes later (several, don't remember and can't see history now) when reloading my watchlist, I saw it tagged with A7. History tab, what has happened? It went something like this: Deprodded by an IP (classic). Deprodding good-faithed Twinkle-reverted by a new'ish editor (also classic). Deprodded again by same IP. Then A7-tagged by the same new'ish editor. Upon refreshing the page, it had just been deleted under A7. Not the end of the world, but still ... To me NextGenSearchBot looks like software, has anyone argued it be web content? The PROD you show me there, not seen that one before. I suppose we can assume it is a fallacy that goes like "software is under NCORP, corps are under A7, so software is under A7".
An NPP flag has long been needed, hopefully the entry level for Twinkle use?
I encountered the same problem with an article the other day. It had a CCS and it was deleted minutes after the A7 tag removal. There's a discussion about it at WT:CSD, which brings me to another problem; WP:NOTINHERITED. A lot of people think that applies to A7 and significance as much as AfD and notability, even though neither A7 or significance are even mentioned. They also treat it as policy rather than an opinion; although it's a very valid one, that's beside the point. Such people clearly don't understand significance, as User:SoWhy explained when I asked him about it and his essay WP:A7M. That isn't the first time people have cited WP:NOTINHERITED as why the claims listed there are not claims of significance. It rather annoys me that there's such a lack of understanding, especially among experienced editors and even admins. The only explanation I can think of for the "consensus" a certain editor keeps reminding me of, is that he thinks a certain number of wrongs somehow make a right. They do not. While I'm talking about experienced editors and getting A7 wrong, here's another one made by an editor who's been here for over 7 years. As for that BLPPROD, it was invalid because there was a reference. I haven't done as much on that, but invalid BLPPRODs seem almost as common as invalid A7s. A lot of people think that a link is only a reference if it has an inline citation, and don't seem to have heard of general references. It's shocking that even experienced admins are making such mistakes. BTW, I believe software comes under the products guideline, not corporations (there's an essay on software notability, which looks like it's derived from the products guideline), and there's disagreement about what constitutes web content. I've launched an RfC about that. There's a loophole which places a lot of software under the web content category, which therefore (in theory) makes them eligible for A7, despite them being explicitly excluded. Adam9007 (talk) 14:35, 1 May 2016 (UTC)
CCS: Is that confusion with NOTINHERITED because CCS will sometimes be determined based on a credible association? "John Doe had his first major role in Filmtitle." Maybe he's not ready to meet ACTOR/BASIC, but he's not A7 fodder, if we have Filmtitle. But this has nothing to do with NOINHERITED, as that deals with notability.
NOTINHERITED: To use this or any other AADDs (condensed version) in connection with a CSD debate is not logical to me. -- Speedy - PROD/BLPPROD - xFD. -- NOTINHERITED is part of the process that deals with determining notability. And WP:N with all its subsets of guidelines or even an essay specifically on xFD, should not be dragged over in the Speedy department. Two departments. Two toolsets. Is INHERITED mentioned at CSD? No. Think it should be? File a proposal. Use it as an argument on WT:CSD until then? No.
I was thinking, over at WP:AFCR we have a fine flowchart; do we have something similar for DELPRO?
I am all for helping each other here becoming more competent. This is a case of an organization, where everybody can join, who demands no admission test whatsoever, who offers very little in terms of basic training (TWA), and who does not demand taking formal training (NPP, CVU, mentorship) before using heavy equipment (Twinkle). But, this is what so many good people have agreed it should be over the course of 15 years, so that's how it is. For now. And that demands a great deal of understanding for each other and our different levels of competence and incompetence. And such an understanding is worthwhile developing.
As you may know from real life, tenure does not always equal the best qualified person for the job. Same here. Look at the stubborn case of IDHT where we met. Did you ever compare RfAs from 2005-06 and now?
But yes, the common STICKY mistake and the just as common {{Unreferenced}}/{{BLP unsourced}} mistake is something I would not expect from anyone who comes here regularly for a year or two. Coming from a user with admim tools after ten years ... job training. Inevitably I think the beautiful Lennon'ish idea that we could come together in a collaboratively environment has in-build flaws. But ... the project sure survives!
SOFTWARE: Yes, I know NSOFT, and when I say software falls under NCORP it's sheer habit, because that's the main subject specific guideline and one criterion in that guideline is PRODUCT. At worst here you can accuse me for being sloppy, which won't be the last time you get that opportunity in this jungle! :) Where's that RfC located? Regards, Sam Sailor23:51, 1 May 2016 (UTC)
I know about NOTINHERITED, but as I've previously mentioned, some people simply do not understand. I tried to get them to understand here in the discussion (I'll just link there rather than repeat everything here), but with no success. Should I take the article to DRV? I think SoWhy's explanation is more than sufficient as to why NOTINHERITED doesn't apply to A7.
I agree. I don't think people realise just what significance is; the possibility of notability. Obviously, being closely associated with something or someone notable is going to give the subject a fair chance of notability. It beats me why people don't see that. In fact, someone launched an RfC about NOTINHERITED applying to significance. NOTINHERITED is about something not actually being notable purely by association, not merely having a possibility of notability. There's also the fact that a lot of people confuse significance with notability, which of course further complicates matters because they think that by removing an A7 tag, I'm implying inherited notability, not just significance.
It doesn't look like we have a flowchart for DELPRO.
Maybe the reason no formal training or testing is required is because the proper experience can only be gained by actually doing it? But the problem with this is that if they keep getting away with getting it wrong, people are going to think it's right. As I've already said, no amount of wrongs make a right. It doesn't matter how many people get it wrong, it's still wrong.
Yeah, I've been looking through the unsourced articles categories and I've lost count of how many articles actually do have at least one source, but merely no inline citations.
Thanks for the link to the script, though I'm not sure if it's necessary. Is there any benefit to using it instead of going into the history and view the page logs from there?
@Adam9007: deletionFinder.js: It's a huge benefit over manual look-up, try load Noninvasive follicular thyroid neoplasm with papillary like nuclear features. See the prev dels to the right of the article title? I believe you have met the deleter. Now, why was this deleted as A11 in the first place? Another example, load up Codex Turicensis. See the prev AfDs to the right of the article title? The benefit of this the moment you load a page is well worth having the script running. Makes determining G4 and G5 candidates much quicker. Sam Sailor16:53, 3 May 2016 (UTC)
Yes, I see it. So it's a shortcut? Thanks for your email by the way; I'm wary about replying because doing so will reveal my full identity, which I'd rather not do on a site like this (I actually had difficulty picking a username for here). On that note, I've noticed that WP:IMPORTANCE redirects to Misplaced Pages:Notability, which could be contributing to the confusion. Of course, I've launched an RfD about it :). Adam9007 (talk) 17:09, 3 May 2016 (UTC)
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Here's your quick overview of what has been happening around Wikidata over the last week.Wikidata's coverage as of April 2016Difference of Wikidata's coverage between April 2016 and 6 month before
Category reports on without claims by site now link to PetScan's fast "has no statements"-option. A report for your preferred Misplaced Pages can be added.
Substantially reduced server load for item and property displaying (phab:T132662)
There are currently some issues with the order of latitude/longitude inn coordinates in the query service map visualization. It will be fixed tonight.
Removed unsupported sort and dir parameters from the wikibase.api.RepoApi JavaScript module. This may break user JavaScript calling getEntitiesByPage (phab:T119856).
Worked on new flyers for institutions that want to cooperate with Wikidata and developers wanting to use our data (will be published on Commons once they're done)
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Fixed a bug where admins got a blank page when trying to view deleted revisions (phabricator:T132645)
Investigating issues with bad suggestions for properties when adding new statements (phabricator:T132839)
@Fleet Admiral Ali: You wrote: I'm glad you ended the rude deletions of my article, thank you! I wanted to ask you, though, if I complete my article tonight, can you review and publish it by tomorrow? I have to have this article up by a deadline, and I really need some help. So will you be able to look it through tonight/tomorrow?
I can review it. I can not promise it will be accepted into main space. That depends on contents and sourcing. Misplaced Pages:Your first article is one of several links you will find helpful. What kind of deadline are you dealing with? Sam Sailor23:12, 4 May 2016 (UTC)
Thank you! I will have it done by Friday Night at 11:00 MT, I am trying to get this done and out by Monday in order to impress a potential employer (which I'm gunning hard for an internship from), and I just want to show that I not only take initiative but that I am also learned in the workings of his company. I'm really, really obliged you'll help me!
Ali. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Fleet Admiral Ali (talk • contribs) 04:05, 5 May 2016 (UTC)
Hi Sam, thank you so much for all the work that you put into this article. The one part that I'm not clear on are the changes that you made to the notable works list. You appear to have added some cite book references inline rather than as actual references, the net result being that the list is not well formatted. I am happy to clean it up, but I'm not sure what the intent was so I'm not sure of the best approach to re-formatting it. Robman94 (talk) 18:22, 5 May 2016 (UTC)
Hi Robman94 You can use a {{cite book}} inside ref tags when referencing a book source. You can use a cite book in (typically) a bulleted list, e.g. a Bibliography section. I hope this clears up matters. Thanks for your concern. Sam Sailor18:26, 5 May 2016 (UTC)
Yeah, I use cite book for references all the time, but take a look at the resulting list of books that the author has written, most have a bullet, the year, the title and an English translation, but the entries that you have added appear indented and have a bullet, the author's name, a year, title, publisher, ISBN, etc and many are out of sequence with the rest of the years in the list. I wasn't sure if these cite book entries are there to support the existing entries as references or if they are all new books. Some appear to be new titles and some appear to be repeats of titles already in the list. My thinking is that I should convert them all into references, and then, for the ones that are new titles, add entries for those titles. What do you think? Robman94 (talk) 22:22, 5 May 2016 (UTC)
I think we should try to do that which gives the reader the best article. My idea was to indent translations. That's why you have out of sequence items. I have added an authormask and a small comment to the indented bullet items, does that clarify it? If not, we should find a better solution, definitely.
Google Books does not index any of Lund Eriksen's books in Norwegian. (Let that be a reminder to those who believe that Google indexes non-English languages as well as it does English.) Ideally somebody would make a nice {{Cite book}} manually for his Norwegian titles. But it is fine as it is with referenced raw titles.
I like that way you "stack" the references inside a {{reflist|refs=}} and use a named ref tag inline. Gives a very nice clarity to the body text. Sam Sailor09:07, 6 May 2016 (UTC)
Yeah, once I discovered that feature, there was no going back. It makes reading the article in edit mode so much easier. Robman94 (talk) 12:40, 6 May 2016 (UTC)
Hello, I am a new editor here on Misplaced Pages. I wrote my first article, after reading through all the guidelines and recommendations. Long story short, the article was nominated for deletion. After it was nominated and a discussion was started, an editor named Velella attempted to delete the page through speedy deletion. He almost got away with it, but I did some more research and, very politely, called him on it. To his credit, he rolled things back and the page is now still in discussion. I believe that I angered him and he is set to now get the page deleted through the article for deletion process. Others have found counsel from you before, so I wanted to seek your wisdom on the best way to handle the situation. If you have time, I would value your thoughts, I am new here and hope to be around a while. Thank you.
Hi FeelTheBernBaby, and welcome to Misplaced Pages. Whatever happens to Wild Bunch Paintball Team, do not despair. There will be other stuff that you can do here, if you want to.
WP:42 may already be familiar to you: "Articles generally require significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the topic." If you out of the 55 current citations you should chose the three you find are best in terms of coverage, reliability, and independence, which three would that be? Sam Sailor08:30, 6 May 2016 (UTC)
Sam,
Wow! How you did that overnight, is beyond me. Thank you! The references look a lot cleaner (tricks I shall learn, hopefully). One of the biggest difficulties on the subject I chose is that the coverage is mainly in now-defunct mediums. It has been a nightmare trying to find accessible copies of the magazines, and, in most cases, I have not found the articles in full themselves, so I lack even the ability to read the full article for comparison. The issues and features were talked about all over on sources that don't matter (private chat rooms, online forums, and the like), but the result is limited to other people's feedback about the articles, not the articles themselves. What little I can find, via the methods above, about the two new issues that got added, suggest that they might be fantastic. An article centered on the team and one detailing the success of their charity work (which dovetails nicely into the rest of the page). I am shopping around to see if I can buy (hopefully multiple issues, to have one scanned and then donated into my library system) to examine. Beyond that, the Paintball Games International issue created the biggest splash online, but, again, I have not been able to find a copy for myself. So, that is where I am at with my continued research. Appearently, toward the end of their original charity series, the games received local media coverage too, so I am at least trying to track that down as well. That's where I am at. Thank you again for your help, you are one of very few who have helped since I joined the community, and I appreciate your time and response.FeelTheBernBaby (talk) 12:44, 6 May 2016 (UTC)
The single edit I did to Wild Bunch Paintball Team was simply to run WP:REFILL on the article. And if you stick around you will get to know tools like that as well.
Okay, good to know. Though I feel like I have learned a lot in a short time, the amount I have yet to learn seems daunting. Those are/were the largest publications in the history of paintball thus far, so, if they fall short somehow, paintball will be a pretty hard topic on which to get anything to stay. There is a chance that they were featured in a book, I plan to order it and verify. I placed a few calls to local news stations and newspapers that are believed to have covered/run stories on the team. In total, I spent more than 40 hours on this, mainly on research, so it is pretty deflating to see it fizzle out. Thank you for your encouragement, I will be sure to look at that project (though it may be a bit, this took a lot out of me and now I have some life things to get caught up on). Thanks again.FeelTheBernBaby (talk) 00:03, 7 May 2016 (UTC)
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I am both pleased and honored to present you with the Silk Purse Award in appreciation for your superb improvements to the Endre Lund Eriksen article, essentially changing what was seen through lack of diligence by some as a sow's ear, and making it into a terrific silk purse. Schmidt, 15:33, 8 May 2016 (UTC)
Yes, anyone could have... but YOU chose to do so. And while the nominator may have failed in his preliminary searches before deciding the topic non-notable, BLP articles from the outset need to include better sourcing than might an article on a film or farm implement, else be taken quickly to CSD or AFD. Worse was an editor who opined a delete without even looking for sources. Good job in addressing concerns so quickly and so well. Schmidt, 18:52, 8 May 2016 (UTC)
Our Main Page now has a section for popular items to show you what is trending on Wikidata based on several people editing an item over the last few days
It was not, and STICKY makes it very clear: "Only add a BLPPROD if there are no sources in any form that name the subject ... This compromise avoids the need for judgement calls about reliability of sources for placement". Sam Sailor18:52, 9 May 2016 (UTC)
Admins are humans too, friend. (But, granted, this mistake I would not expect from someone with the sysop flag.) Sam Sailor18:56, 9 May 2016 (UTC)
I know, but admins are trusted to get it right (that's why they're admins). They're heavily involved in explaining policy to others. If they're getting it wrong, and are passing misinformation onto others, that's not good. Adam9007 (talk) 19:04, 9 May 2016 (UTC)
Anthony Jakobs
Hi Sam! Long time no speak. I left a note at the AfD - is there a proscription from A7'ng an article if a notability tag has been applied? I didn't know that. I don't do a lot of NPP work, but I rarely A7 an article if it's been created within a day or two, which is basically all that are there these days now that the backlog is gone. I decided this week to tag them for notability, and give the creator a day or two to come up with sourcing. If there's no improvement, I either prod or send to AfD. I try to broadly construe the meaning of "credible claim of significance or importance even if the claim is not supported by a reliable source". In the case of this kid, at what point does a youtuber have significance? Since there's no hard and fast rule, I probably would've prodded it, rather than A7'd it. Regardless, would love to hear your thoughts. Onel5969 12:34, 10 May 2016 (UTC)
Responded at the appropriate venue. ... and good to hear from you onel5969, you joined the OTRS-team I noticed on Meta? Sounds good to me, how you go about with tagging, IMHO there's far too much haste with a lot of A7 among others. In the case of Anthony Jakobs I'd love to hear if other editors find there is a CCS. As you know it is a debated thing for the moment at WT:CSD etc. So, where do you see a CCS since you would have PRODed it? Sam Sailor 12:59, 10 May 2016 (UTC)
Regarding the CSS - like you, I feel there is way too much use of the A7 tag, especially on new articles which aren't given the time to develop. In this particular instance, the youtube thing is what would have stopped me. As I said above, at what point does a youtuber become significant? Personally, I don't think 13000 followers meets that level, but another editor might see it differently, hence my sending it the prod/afd route. I would have tagged it with the notability thing, because despite my not being able to find sources, the article's creator might have access to some. It's happened several times to me in the past, where I've tagged something (either A7, prod or AfD) and the creator (or even another editor) added enough sources that I either missed (by using a different/variant spelling, or adding a + qualifier), or simply did not show up on the search engines. Take care. Onel596913:15, 10 May 2016 (UTC)
@Onel5969: Article states: "In 2013, Jakobs began making short film appearances and posting videos onto video streaming website YouTube." That is the only thing it says about Youtube. Based on that, I see no WP:CCS. The 13,000 followers are not on Youtube, but on Instagram: "Jakobs currently has 13,000+ followers on Instagram." All other mention of "film" is IMHO fluff. E.g. "In 2016, Jakobs independently released a short film titled Untitled Anthony Jakobs film." This is not a "release" in the classical sense of the word with a tour on the short film festival circuit, let alone a regular theatrical distribution. So, if this article is not A7, I'd like to know what is. That was also a reason for opening an AfD discussion. Sam Sailor16:51, 10 May 2016 (UTC)
I wonder if, as someone who knows the oily end of Wiki better than I do, you can shed any light on why an article I moved into mainspace on 30 April does not show up in my list of pages created? Two others moved at the same time do appear. Tony Dean (racing driver) is the offensiveding item. It's only a small thing but 'twas my 50th article and the tiniest rewards are all we can expect! Thanks. Regards, Eagleash (talk) 17:21, 13 May 2016 (UTC)
Thanks! I notice that a re-direct seems to be created automatically when moving out of draft. I don't think that's the problem as they exist for most, if not all, of the pages I've started. VPT looks like the way to solve it. Thanks again. Eagleash (talk) 19:47, 13 May 2016 (UTC)
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Welcome to Misplaced Pages. Although everyone is welcome to contribute constructively to the encyclopedia, we would ask that you assume good faith while interacting with other editors, which you did not on Misplaced Pages:Articles_for_deletion/FLAVORx. Take a look at the welcome page to learn more about contributing to this encyclopedia. Please do not make out that I did not perform diligence to that article.Tom2973922:51, 16 May 2016 (UTC)
I know it's not really a big deal, but if you are going to thank people for taking part in a discussion then it's a bit strange that you should miss one out. Remember that IPs are human too. 86.17.222.157 (talk) 21:37, 17 May 2016 (UTC)
But, MichaelQSchmidt, the article looked like this, you would not ask people to expand from the French where she made a lot of her work, and go searching for sources would you? It's so much more effective to send it to AfD and let other's do the work. ;) Sam Sailor23:51, 17 May 2016 (UTC)
Deciding an (originally) unsourced topic to be automatically something unimprovable is not a proper deletion rationale and instead reflects a WP:PPOV. Stating someone's parentage is perfectly acceptable in a BLP, and WP:NONENGISH sourcing is perfectly fine for someone raised in France. Expecting others to do the work is not how it's done. Schmidt, 01:10, 18 May 2016 (UTC)
Hi Sam, I apologize for the comment yesterday, RL is a bugger right now and I think I'm losing it ,
Anyway thanks for the email which I'll take on board :),
Anyway apologies again, Happy editing :), Thanks, –Davey201007:58, 18 May 2016 (UTC)
@Davey2010: I don't think your comment warranted an apology, but thanks anyway. And be sure, what I wrote in the email was only meant as a friendly FYI in case you had missed it. Nothing "Now listen up, lad .." was intended. :) Cheers, Sam Sailor08:30, 18 May 2016 (UTC)
Hi Sam, It did - I pretty much had a go at you for you simply giving me advice and I'll be honest I was out of order,
Anyway no worries, I know and that's how I perceived it and I do greatly appreciate you giving me a little heads up there :),
Thank you for your kind gesture, and thank you for noticing. In cases like Misplaced Pages:Articles for deletion/FLAVORx where the nominator apparently pays little or no attention to WP:BEFORE - much like their other nominations at the same time:
Responded at the appropriate venue. Good find. I got tired of sifting through their contribs and took a break. All edits - incl. those logged out as 
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I reported him at AIV. 
,
Anyway thanks for the email which I'll take on board :),
Anyway apologies again, Happy editing :), Thanks, –