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Revision as of 22:53, 4 July 2020

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Hello, Sirjohnperrot, and welcome to Misplaced Pages! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Unfortunately, one or more of your recent edits to the page Gruffydd ap Rhys did not conform to Misplaced Pages's verifiability policy, and may have been removed. Misplaced Pages articles should refer only to facts and interpretations verified in reliable, reputable print or online sources or in other reliable media. Always provide a reliable source for quotations and for any material that is likely to be challenged, or it may be removed. Misplaced Pages also has a related policy against including original research in articles.

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May 2020

Your recent editing history at Laugharne shows that you are currently engaged in an edit war; that means that you are repeatedly changing content back to how you think it should be, when you have seen that other editors disagree. To resolve the content dispute, please do not revert or change the edits of others when you are reverted. Instead of reverting, please use the talk page to work toward making a version that represents consensus among editors. The best practice at this stage is to discuss, not edit-war. See the bold, revert, discuss cycle for how this is done. If discussions reach an impasse, you can then post a request for help at a relevant noticeboard or seek dispute resolution. In some cases, you may wish to request temporary page protection.

Being involved in an edit war can result in you being blocked from editing—especially if you violate the three-revert rule, which states that an editor must not perform more than three reverts on a single page within a 24-hour period. Undoing another editor's work—whether in whole or in part, whether involving the same or different material each time—counts as a revert. Also keep in mind that while violating the three-revert rule often leads to a block, you can still be blocked for edit warring—even if you don't violate the three-revert rule—should your behavior indicate that you intend to continue reverting repeatedly.

Please use the talk page -----Snowded 07:35, 29 May 2020 (UTC)

• It was entirely predictable that you would attempt to insert Laugharne into the articles of the two sons of he after which you have named yourself which is why I put them under watch. If you can find proper references then it is relevant there. However a simple birth or death is not enough of itself to establish notability for an article about a town. Please review wikipedia policy on sourcing and also relevance -----Snowded 08:23, 31 May 2020 (UTC)≈

• Indeed so, my edits were to make it plain they both had initimate connections with Laugharne, unlike most of the rest of the notable residents on the current list. Along with Sir John, only Madam Bevan and Dylan Thomas lived in the township as adults and none were born there.The others all left at an early age never to return as residents and George Abbey as far as I can see, has never set foot in the place!
  In contrast Sir James was probably born and certainly brought up in the lordship, living at Westmead until 1602. Sir Thomas Perrot inherited the Castle along with the rest of Sir John's estate in the locality (according to tradition, where he already resided at Roche Castle prior to his father's death.) His sole surviving child Penelope later occupied the family property at nearby Trefenty. I look forward to your restoration of my edits and of course I'm happy to consider any reasonable amendments to comply with wikipedia policies if you think there is a conflict.Sirjohnperrot (talk) 11:43, 31 May 2020 (UTC)

• If you want to make a case to remove any of those in the existing list fine. Otherwise I have made what I consider reasonable changes to your edits on both articles and I don't think there is any case for changing the Laugharne so if you want to make changes there you will need to get other editors to agree with you on the talk page. I'd recommend you spend some more time on articles where you don't have a strong view/personal interest to get more familiar with editing practices. It is never easy for a new editor to handle the balance of their enthusiasm with established practice on Misplaced Pages. -----Snowded 12:36, 31 May 2020 (UTC)

• Imputing a lack of neutrality/excess of zeal on my part is unhelpful and mistaken. My username was chosen years ago and has no relevance.
  Our only concern here should be that the Notable Residents section of the Laugharne article is accurate and consistent. For clarity's sake when discussion resumes to the Article's Talk Page (which it should not have left notwithstanding your rather puzzling closure fiat) it may help focus on the relevant issues if you can simply answer my questions below as previously asked and thus far ignored:
  1) Why do you consider Sir James Perrot is not a notable resident of Laugharne?
  2) Why do you consider Sir Thomas Perrot is not a notable resident of Laugharne?
  
  Sirjohnperrot (talk) 14:22, 31 May 2020 (UTC)

• Really? Years ago? You have not been editing wikipedia for more than a year. Your first seven edits were last year in July and August, two early this year and since then every single edit has being linked to promoting the name of Perrot so I think we are all allowed to assume some relevance. You can resume the talk page converation anytime you want, but without more support from other editors you will have issues. A less ambitous proposal (for example adding "and his sons X&Y" with links might be more acceptable and we can discuss that -----Snowded 14:37, 31 May 2020 (UTC)

Yes 2 years ago - that's what my Talk page says at the top. None of my handful of contributions up to this encounter with you have been about Perrots and your reply yet again fails to address the obvious question asked. Instead it is used as a vehicle for more mendacious absurdities. My mobile phone doesn't seem to recognise the indentation code btw Sirjohnperrot (talk) 15:01, 31 May 2020 (UTC)

You have made 50 edits, the first two in July 2019 (less than a year ago) were to Gruffydd ap Rhys which were reverted for failing Misplaced Pages's criteria for verifiabilty. 80% of those 50 edits related to articles where you are promoting the name Perrot which you have assumed as your nom de plume. There is nothing at the top of your talk or user page which says differently. It is hardly a mendacious absurdity to assume you are on a mission here. I've answered your two questions and tried to help out by suggesting something less ambitious that you could put forward on the Laugharne talk page. -----Snowded 15:31, 31 May 2020 (UTC)

The screenshot of the notification panel on my Talk page above, which you claim does not exist, shows my username registration two years ago. It incontrovertibly demonstrates the absurdity of your accusations that I am on here only to promote Perrots. Your characterisation of my post history is equally ridiculous, this current exchange contains the only references to that name. You have repeatedly failed to justify deleting my additions to the notable residents list for Laugharne and are apparently unable to grasp the wikipedia policies on relevance and notability.

I am now transferring this discussion back to the article's Talk page in the hope that an editorial consensus will enable my edit adding Sir James Perrot and Sir Thomas Perrot to be restored, as was the case with Sir John Perrot whose entry you also deleted and failed to restore for no good reason.
Sirjohnperrot (talk) 20:20, 31 May 2020 (UTC)

And that confirms your first edit was within a year and you haven't contested the 80% of your edits promote Perrots and it is reasonable that links to your choice of name. Otherwise you have been given reasons you just don't like them. I do love, after over a decade of editing being told by someone with just 50 that I don't understand policites on relevance and notability - its quaint :-). You should not transfer the aove material to the talk page of the article so I have deleted it. You are free and should make the case for inclusion of their names and the form of inclusion. Your previous elaboration (way beyond a simple mention) was referted for the reasons given. It is now down to you to see if you can engage other editors. I've suggested one compromise above you might want to consider that. -----Snowded 20:54, 31 May 2020 (UTC)

More graceless and dishonest nonsense. The Blind Pugh could see that 99% of this exchange is not about Perrots at all but simply the consequence of your transparently irrational grounds for preventing legitimate editing. Deleting relevant material from a Talk page solely to spare your blushes also constitutes vandalism and hopefully will be noticed by those who administrate the project.
Sirjohnperrot (talk) 21:35, 31 May 2020 (UTC)

Feel free to raise my behaviour at ANI if you really think that, but I suspect you might be in for a a suprise if you do. -----Snowded 04:14, 1 June 2020 (UTC)

if you had a shred of integrity you would report yourself and undertake to desist from future puerile behaviour.Sirjohnperrot (talk) 08:01, 1 June 2020 (UTC)

Personal attacks are not encouraged here.-----Snowded 09:32, 1 June 2020 (UTC)

• How 'quaint'
  
  Sirjohnperrot (talk) 11:52, 1 June 2020 (UTC)

Hello, I've replied to your message on my talk page. Cheers, Airplaneman (talk) ✈ 20:14, 1 June 2020 (UTC)

As per my response on my talk page, I've noted your violation of the three revert rule but have decided that only the next infraction should result in a block--not for punitive purposes, but for preventative purposes. Airplaneman (talk) ✈ 20:44, 1 June 2020 (UTC)

Merger

You need to layout the argument for the merger on the talk page - and handle the policy link from the one reject so far. Asking the local officials for their opinion isn't going to cut it unless they point you to reliable sources that would support the idea that the two are defacto the same. These discussions have momentum on wikipedia so you need to accept soon as a pattern of three/four rejections will likely be followed. I've asked a question to clarify how the pollicy is interpreted. Challenging policy never really works .... -----Snowded 10:01, 4 June 2020 (UTC)

Thanks for the comments they are much appreciated. I think the merger proposal has gained another distinguished supporter in Tony and real momentum as a result. His point about the difference between policy and guidance is well made and should take us over the line - how do we know when that's happened?Sirjohnperrot (talk) 20:59, 4 June 2020 (UTC)

Give it a few days -----Snowded 14:08, 5 June 2020 (UTC)

You're now my favourite Misplaced Pages editor of all time ;-)Sirjohnperrot (talk) 22:44, 6 June 2020 (UTC)

Not sure I can live up to that. Misplaced Pages is a strange beast, I started editing after a friend said it was a great example of a complex adaptive system (my field) which it is and then got addicted. A couple of interactions with Jimmy Wales at various conferences where we were both keynotes cemented the interest. Key thing is patience and paying attention to the protocols for sourcing and behaviour. Right normally wins out. If you want help on any other article while you get settled in let me know. -----Snowded 06:00, 7 June 2020 (UTC)

Thanks for the offer, the current article is clearly in need of improvement given its low quality rating and I'm hoping to work on some of the sections based on best practice identified in the Wales Project list of B level entries for similar settlements.Sirjohnperrot (talk) 10:20, 7 June 2020 (UTC)

Hello :)

Hello,

I'm a new member just starting out here and have come across your profile as I was leaving a message on Redrose64's account. I didn't appreciate the way she spoke to you and I'd just like you to know that even know I'm new here too, I'm here to help if you need it :)

Eat Your Makeup (talk) 14:38, 9 June 2020 (UTC)

I think it's some kind of initiation ceremony ;) Thank you for your kind offer, they say "experience is what we call our mistakes" and it seems I'm very experienced already!

Sirjohnperrot (talk) 17:19, 9 June 2020 (UTC)

June 2020

Your addition to Rowland Laugharne has been removed in whole or in part, as it appears to have added copyrighted material to Misplaced Pages without evidence of permission from the copyright holder. If you are the copyright holder, please read Misplaced Pages:Donating copyrighted materials for more information on uploading your material to Misplaced Pages. For legal reasons, Misplaced Pages cannot accept copyrighted material, including text or images from print publications or from other websites, without an appropriate and verifiable license. All such contributions will be deleted. You may use external websites or publications as a source of information, but not as a source of content, such as sentences or images—you must write using your own words. Misplaced Pages takes copyright very seriously, and persistent violators of our copyright policy will be blocked from editing. See Misplaced Pages:Copying text from other sources for more information. — Diannaa (talk) 12:33, 23 June 2020 (UTC)

offending sentence corrected as identified - please see your talk page Sirjohnperrot (talk) 14:40, 23 June 2020 (UTC)

Laugharne

I am sorry that you are upset with what I wrote at Talk:Laugharne.

I warned that the link to your archive.org page appeared to be a breach of the WP:ELNEVER policy, but you have restored the link. ELNEVER is an official policy of Misplaced Pages, and knowingly breaching it invites sanctions. Verbcatcher (talk) 18:09, 30 June 2020 (UTC)

Wrong again Sirjohnperrot (talk) 19:46, 30 June 2020 (UTC)

Sorry, I was mistaken in saying that you had reverted my edit and had reintroduced the link, I apologise. Verbcatcher (talk) 22:31, 30 June 2020 (UTC)

July 2020

Please do not attack other editors. Comment on content, not on contributors. Personal attacks damage the community and deter users. Please stay cool and keep this in mind while editing. Thank you. Consider this a formal warning - you are no longer a newcomer. You have been advised to tone it down by several experienced editors. If you can't moderate your tone and assume good faith then we notch this up a level and ask the community to review your behaviour. -----Snowded 14:35, 2 July 2020 (UTC)

You might ask them to review yours while they are at it, is there a policy which ap condones zero content continuous threatening behaviour Sirjohnperrot (talk) 14:48, 2 July 2020 (UTC)

Anytime you want to report my or any other editors behaviour feel free to take it to ANI. Most of us have been trying in various ways to help you - my merging the articles for example. But your response lacks any grace you just let rip at any editor who crosses you now matter how politely they explain why. That will no longer be tolerated -----Snowded 17:41, 2 July 2020 (UTC)

This comment has been reported as yet another personal attack - see your talk page. I might just add that you didn't support the merged article until a consensus in favour had already been achieved. Anyway it was the right result - bit like tonight's ;)Sirjohnperrot (talk) 21:28, 2 July 2020 (UTC)

Please note that it is not acceptable practice to revert deletion of comments from someone's talk page other than in very restricted circumstances. The ONLY things that I am prepared to accept from you on my talk page are (i) Polite requests for help, (ii) Responses to requests that name you or (iii) where wikipedia policy requires you to place a notice - for example if you decide to take your various grevances to the wider community in which case a user page notification is mandated. I will adopt the same policy in respect of any postings here. I've given you fair warning that continued personal attacks on other editors and practices such as altering source material to support a conflict you are having on another article will result in a request for the comunity to consider if your contributions are helping or hindering the project.-----Snowded 06:46, 3 July 2020 (UTC)

Why do you persist with these antagonstic and disingenuous remarks and indulge in exactly the behaviour you are falsely accusing me of? Please stay off my talk page unless you have something relevant to Misplaced Pages content and please stay out of my exchanges with other editors that don't involve you. Sirjohnperrot (talk) 09:11, 3 July 2020 (UTC)

My comment, containing a Misplaced Pages notice, should not have been deleted and has been restored together with a further notice. Please do not delete it again and abide by Wiki rules in future. Sirjohnperrot (talk) 10:21, 3 July 2020 (UTC)

Sirjohnperrot, Snowded is free to remove anything from their user talk page as they see fit. You have also made claims of personal attacks, but have not provided evidence of these — which makes it an aspersion. Please add evidence or withdraw the claim. Your own conduct as an editor may also be examined for problems. Please take note. El_C 13:22, 3 July 2020 (UTC)

Sirjohnperrot, saying that your response "lacks grace" is not a personal attack. El_C 13:41, 3 July 2020 (UTC)

Only warning Reporting at AIV as you did was entirely inappropriate. You are on the verge of being blocked from editing. Please substantiate your claims at ANI or withdraw the complaint. --Deepfriedokra (talk) 13:44, 3 July 2020 (UTC)`~

I strongly advise you to go drop whatever this is about, and find other things to edit here.Slatersteven (talk) 13:57, 3 July 2020 (UTC)

Sirjohnperrot you're a stone throws a way from being blocked per WP:CIR, Is this really a hill you want to die on ?, Like everyone else above I would strongly suggest you do the good thing and withdraw the complaint otherwise I fear your time here could be cut very short indeed, Ignore Snowded and go back to article editing which is what we're all here for :), Happy editing!, –Davey2010 15:27, 3 July 2020 (UTC)

Actually, the (libel) legal threat forces our hand. That needs to be withdrawn/made clear that it is not intended as such. --Deepfriedokra (talk) 15:36, 3 July 2020 (UTC)

RE: "libel"

Please categorically withdraw any threat of legal actions. El_C 14:11, 3 July 2020 (UTC)

Conflict of interests disclosure

Hello, Sirjohnperrot. We welcome your contributions, but if you have an external relationship with the people, places or things you have written about on Misplaced Pages, you may have a conflict of interest (COI). Editors with a conflict of interest may be unduly influenced by their connection to the topic. See the conflict of interest guideline and FAQ for organizations for more information. We ask that you:

• avoid editing or creating articles about yourself, your family, friends, colleagues, company, organization or competitors;
• propose changes on the talk pages of affected articles (you can use the {{request edit}} template);
• disclose your conflict of interest when discussing affected articles (see Misplaced Pages:Conflict of interest#How to disclose a COI);
• avoid linking to your organization's website in other articles (see WP:Spam);
• do your best to comply with Misplaced Pages's content policies.

In addition, you are required by the Wikimedia Foundation's terms of use to disclose your employer, client, and affiliation with respect to any contribution which forms all or part of work for which you receive, or expect to receive, compensation. See Misplaced Pages:Paid-contribution disclosure.

Also, editing for the purpose of advertising, publicising, or promoting anyone or anything is not permitted. Thank you. El_C 15:16, 3 July 2020 (UTC)

It's very good of you to provide this time limited opportunity to rescue my maligned reputation and indeed even afford me a sight of the instruments. The audience seems impatient though and I don’t detect much trembling with indignation at any injustice to me so I don't propose to detain your deliberations with trivial details from my point of view. The plaintiff switched to the dock does seem a bit like summary justice but presumably that's just the Antipodean way. I naively and clearly mistakenly believed that even a cursory examination of Snowded's comments to and about me on the various Talk Pages (including the top of this one) would supply the necessary evidence of his unacceptable behaviour - it has been noticed by other users I believe. Turns out the opportunity for him to settle old scores proved just to juicy to resist when I crossed swords with Verbcatcher and he certainly backed a winner with you eager chaps on the buttons - good to see you enjoy your work so much. You'll allow it is a little discouraging for me to read that you have already joined that deadly duo in jovial agreement that dishonesty really doesn't matter on here. For the record, I enjoyed myself in the short time I was a Misplaced Pages editor and my thanks to those that helped me contribute, including the curates eggs currently celebrating my demise. Well done everybody

I didn't intend to die on hill or in a ditch or anywhere else but others clearly were- sentence appears to have been passed and the Admin page seems to be off limits now - never mind. No legal threat quasi or otherwise btw – just taken from the Wiki section header - or any conflict of interest either - just another couple of fictions turned into virtual fact by Misplaced Pages's finest.Sirjohnperrot (talk) 15:56, 3 July 2020 (UTC)

Sirjohnperrot, in fairness, you can't fault us for doing our due diligence. El_C 15:59, 3 July 2020 (UTC)

There was no threat of anything and not bothering to look at the evidence isn't diligent, it's actually very unfair. Sirjohnperrot (talk) 16:02, 3 July 2020 (UTC)

Sirjohnperrot, the possible legal threat and conflict of interests were only things you were able to disclose, yourself. You have not been treated unfairly. El_C 16:05, 3 July 2020 (UTC)

And, you have been asked repeatedly to respond in the WP:ANI thread you started. You accused another editor of personal attacks. Please, show us where. Page name- section- sentence number will do. Thanks, --Deepfriedokra (talk) 16:20, 3 July 2020 (UTC)

Deepfriedokra, it's at the top of the July 2020 section. It is not a personal attack. El_C 16:26, 3 July 2020 (UTC)

That dry, meatless bone? I wanted something juicy to sink my teeth into. I thought it was elsewhere. Certainly Sir John has spent enough effort warning Snowded about NPA. ANd then the ANI thread? Sir John, was there anything else you regarded as a personal attack? --Deepfriedokra (talk) 16:30, 3 July 2020 (UTC)

Sir John, you used the word "libel" here Can you show us where such libel occurred? Please? --Deepfriedokra (talk) 16:32, 3 July 2020 (UTC)

* Deepfriedokra It's Sirjohnperrot actually, my soubriquet and please don't tamper with it. First, the reason I didn't respond earlier on the Admin Noticeboard 'Snowded Report' section I created (now missing) was that I was blocked - unlike everybody else.

A few lines above this I've already pointed out the phrase that contains the word 'libel' is in the section title of the warning template I used "Inserting factual inaccuracies and/or libel" it's a Misplaced Pages term not mine- got that yet? I've only made two posts on this subject and you don't seem to have read either. The purpose of the warning was the same as the purpose of my report which was to stop Snowded spreading Verbcatcher's disgraceful lie on the Laugharne talk page that I manufactured a reference. You and your fellow admin may care to read about it there and on his talkpage as I suggested. Interesting both you and El_C find Snowded's blatant lies on here about my user registration date such unremarkable fare. When you call other people liars in your part of the world do they not regard it as a personal attack? Very curious that, almost unbelievable.

This was my first talkpage interaction on Misplaced Pages and revealed that Snowded's reaction to losing the argument on the topic - and also his friend Verbcatcher's later on - is first to resort to lies and then to attempt to justify them by reference to some weird rules of wikiworld they knew I'd probably never even have heard of (let alone appreciate their significance) as a novice editor. Now I'm confronted with a new set of lies complete with a new set of weird justifications. According to you I made legal threats and according to someone else I probably have some shadowy conflict of interest and by another I was charged with making 'aspersions'. One of the admin cheerleaders on the Admin Noticeboard Redrose64 actually talked about Family History Societies as if they were all run by Charles Manson - quite astonishing. In fact my 3 critics (there were only 3 including her btw - before you lot turned up) were given full rein and some applause while I was blocked from contributing. I felt like Sergeant Howie in a bushwacker version of The Wicker Man.

Anyway, let's move on, jokes aside I think this matter raises important questions about the way administrators have handled my report. Reading the first comments by yourself and other admins on here it's pretty clear that any semblance of fairness or even-handedness is completely absent from the off. The blunt outcome was that within a few minutes of reporting a personal attack I was told, alongside several other unsubstantiated accusations, I was under imminent threat of being blocked if I didn't withdraw the report immediately. The threat was then made good giving me no opportunity to respond. Now you are compounding this lack of neutrality with a failure to take proper account of the examples I cited and also by making further completely spurious accusations. Where do I go to complain about you? Mr Wales? Sirjohnperrot (talk) 21:57, 3 July 2020 (UTC)

You could respond at the ANI thread you started. You can take it up at WP:AN. Have not blocked you, soI have not made "good" on any "threat". --Deepfriedokra (talk) 22:02, 3 July 2020 (UTC)

(edit conflict) Sirjohnperrot, you have never been blocked. I also don't know why you're expending all that time and effort above. You accused someone of engaging in personal attacks, but you failed to provide evidence. That is on you. Introspection is expected. El_C 22:03, 3 July 2020 (UTC)

From my end any attempt to reply just generated a series of edit conflict messages for over an hour, meanwhile new posts were popping up during that time from an assortment of unfriendly characters who continue their chorus as I type. I'll pop over and educate them about the courtesies expected in a civilised discussion.Sirjohnperrot (talk) 22:15, 3 July 2020 (UTC)

We all get edit conflicts, unfortunately. Yes. I think that would be nice. Thanks. --Deepfriedokra (talk) 22:16, 3 July 2020 (UTC)

You might want to compose your post in your sandbox or a text editor and then paste it in. Sometimes it's the only way. --Deepfriedokra (talk) 22:21, 3 July 2020 (UTC)

Edit conflicts are not the same as blocks in any way, shape or form; your block log is clean - for the moment. Above, you state Redrose64 actually talked about Family History Societies as if they were all run by Charles Manson - where did I do that? Diffs are required to support your claim. --Redrose64 🌹 (talk) 22:55, 3 July 2020 (UTC)

That's a consolation anyway, not for long I'll warrant :) Just a jest about your COI remark, the idea that anybody is related to Sir John would cause some amusement among the Society membership, I'm sorry to say that none of the illustrious Perrot blood runs in my veins or anyone else's as far as is known. The legitimate male blood line ended in 1594 although many have tried to claim it didn't Sirjohnperrot (talk) 23:05, 3 July 2020 (UTC)

If you cannot provide evidence, I ask you to remove your allegations. --Redrose64 🌹 (talk) 10:05, 4 July 2020 (UTC)

A DNA test you mean? (Joke) Which bit of my assessment of your contribution on the Admin Noticeboard Snowded report do you consider as an allegation that you would you like me to verify or remove? If you mean evidence of Snowded's personal attacks I'm not sure any Diffs are needed - as far as I can see none of relevant posts have been edited out. It would be pointless to do so anyway. Sirjohnperrot (talk) 10:18, 4 July 2020 (UTC)

Are you deliberately being difficult? The allegation was on this page, and moreover, was in this section, in the third paragraph of your post of 21:57, 3 July 2020 (UTC). The link immediately preceding this sentence is a diff: it is the means by which I have provided my evidence of your making the claim; now, you have to provide similar evidence that I made the remark that you allude to in that post. Fail to do so, and I shall call WP:NPA on you. --Redrose64 🌹 (talk) 22:52, 4 July 2020 (UTC)

Final warning

Please refrain from passive-aggressive vitriol. Please support your claims with evidence using diffs. Not living up to these terms may lead to sanctions. El_C 02:06, 4 July 2020 (UTC)

El_C May I ask what particular transgression has prompted you to create yet another new charge section on my Talkpage ?

Not sure what you mean about using Diffs either as per my previous post - the evidence is still there, why would it be deleted? It could well be I'm not understanding what is required.

May I also make some observations and ask some questions about your earlier warnings on this page? (The first was made within a few minutes of my report - not a lot of time to review the evidence fairly.)

• "Sirjohnperrot, Snowded is free to remove anything from their user talk page as they see fit. You have also made claims of personal attacks, but have not provided evidence of these — which makes it an aspersion. Please add evidence or withdraw the claim. Your own conduct as an editor may also be examined for problems. Please take note."

also please take note

1) Removing Misplaced Pages warnings from user talk pages is not permitted as far as I understand the rules.

2) I clearly referred to the relevant talkpages for evidence of my complaint in my report.

3) If you don't read them before responding with a warning that does not make it an Aspersion

also re

• Sirjohnperrot, saying that your response "lacks grace" is not a personal attack. El_C 13:41, 3 July 2020 (UTC)

why it is according to Snowded when I applied it to him earlier? (Verbcatcher also thought it was worthy of including in his list of my indictments)

and

Why is this new section warranted - what 'threat' have I made?

• ===RE: "libel"===

Please categorically withdraw any threat of legal actions. El_C 14:11, 3 July 2020 (UTC)

and

why this new section - what conflict do I have and what prompted you to add the other warnings ?

• ==Conflict of interests disclosure==

throwing in for good measure

• receive, compensation. See Misplaced Pages:Paid-contribution disclosure.
• also, editing for the purpose of advertising, publicising, or promoting anyone or anything is not permitted.

Finally, ref your repeated calls for further evidence, did you read this in my last reply to Deepfriedokra?

"The purpose of the warning was the same as the purpose of my report which was to stop Snowded spreading Verbcatcher's disgraceful lie on the Laugharne talk page that I manufactured a reference. You and your fellow admin may care to read about it there and on his talkpage as I suggested. Interesting that both you and El_C find Snowded's blatant lies on here about my user registration date such unremarkable fare. When you call other people liars in your part of the world do they not regard it as a personal attack? Very curious that, almost unbelievable."

If so and you still regard it as inadequate as a reference guide here are the direct links to the sections, they need to be read in their proper context

https://en.wikipedia.org/Talk:Laugharne#Perrot

https://en.wikipedia.org/User_talk:Verbcatcher#Sir_James_Perrot_&_Sir_Sackville_Crowe_of_Westmead

https://en.wikipedia.org/User_talk:Snowded#User_warnings

https://en.wikipedia.org/User_talk:Sirjohnperrot#May_2020

I suppose the edit history commentary on Snowded's Talk Page could prove useful as well.

If after reading those exchanges you don't find evidence to support my report we'll have to go through them in detail together to see why not. Sirjohnperrot (talk) 11:46, 4 July 2020 (UTC)

YOU are meant to go though them in detail such as "here is user calling me a self confessed chicken strangler" (include diff) at the start of any ANI. You have been asked to to this multiple times.Slatersteven (talk) 13:00, 4 July 2020 (UTC)

Hello Sirjohnperrot. Myself & Snowded have had disagreements with each other over the years. I sometimes annoy him & he sometimes annoys me. However in this situation here, it might be best that you acquire a mentor. GoodDay (talk) 14:05, 4 July 2020 (UTC)

Illustration

As you seem to be having some difficulty understanding what you are doing wrong I shall (by way of example) make an allegation against you and then hopefully you will see where the issue lies.

"You have told a pack of lies, I am not going to provide any evidence because anyone can just check your edit history and see that. I want however something done about it by admins, so admins please stop him telling lies"

Do you see why this is problematic? Can you not see how the admins will ask for me to provide evidence? Do you really not see how this really is not actionable?Slatersteven (talk) 14:09, 4 July 2020 (UTC)

• I can't speak for the others, but THIS admin is but a breath away from blocking Sirjohnperrot for refusing to withdraw or provide evidence, and due to a demonstrated inability to work in a collaborative environment. This isn't a threat, it is a statement of intent. We've wasted too much time on this. Dennis Brown - 2¢ 15:22, 4 July 2020 (UTC)

I'd recommend mentorship for him, if he doesn't withdraw or provide evidence in said case. GoodDay (talk) 15:25, 4 July 2020 (UTC)

On a related note...

As a Stockport man of apparent substance, do you know the Battersbys at all? Guy (help!) 20:30, 4 July 2020 (UTC)

I'm pleased my substance is apparent ;) Indeed I do, it was a hatworks on Hempshaw Lane, the building is still there with the name spelt out on the chimney in white bricks, my granny remembered them drying hemp in bundles on the road outside for a rope works there. Sirjohnperrot (talk) 20:57, 4 July 2020 (UTC)

Sirjohnperrot, I know it is, I was wondering if you know the family, not the hat works - they are relatives of mine. Guy (help!) 21:12, 4 July 2020 (UTC)

Sorry, missed the definite article, afraid not - I went to school with a Battersby in the 50s - Stockport Gramnmar, think he was called Dave, nice lad. Sirjohnperrot (talk) 21:16, 4 July 2020 (UTC)