Talk:Gun laws of Australia - Misplaced Pages

This is an old revision of this page, as edited by 2a02:c7d:1ace:600:7996:beb0:26e5:73c0 (talk) at 15:37, 28 March 2017 (→This article does not outline THE ACTUAL GUN LAWS IN AUSTRALIA.: new section). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

Revision as of 15:37, 28 March 2017 by 2a02:c7d:1ace:600:7996:beb0:26e5:73c0 (talk) (→This article does not outline THE ACTUAL GUN LAWS IN AUSTRALIA.: new section)(diff) ← Previous revision | Latest revision (diff) | Newer revision → (diff)

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Gun laws of Australia article.
This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.

Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic.
New to Misplaced Pages? Welcome! Learn to edit; get help.

Article policies

Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL

Archives: Index, 1, 2, 3Auto-archiving period: 12 months

Firearms C‑class Low‑importance

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Firearms, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of firearms on Misplaced Pages. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.FirearmsWikipedia:WikiProject FirearmsTemplate:WikiProject FirearmsFirearms
C	This article has been rated as C-class on Misplaced Pages's content assessment scale.
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Australia: Politics C‑class Mid‑importance

	Australia portal Gun laws of Australia is within the scope of WikiProject Australia, which aims to improve Misplaced Pages's coverage of Australia and Australia-related topics. If you would like to participate, visit the project page.AustraliaWikipedia:WikiProject AustraliaTemplate:WikiProject AustraliaAustralia
C	This article has been rated as C-class on Misplaced Pages's content assessment scale.
Mid	This article has been rated as Mid-importance on the project's importance scale.
	This article is supported by WikiProject Australian politics (assessed as Mid-importance).
	Need help improving this article? Ask a Librarian at the National Library of Australia.
	The Wikimedia Australia chapter can be contacted via email to helpwikimedia.org.au for non-editorial assistance.

On 21 April 2008, Gun laws of Australia was linked from Slashdot, a high-traffic website. (Traffic)

All prior and subsequent edits to the article are noted in its revision history.

Archives

Index 1, 2, 3

This page has archives. Sections older than 365 days may be automatically archived by Lowercase sigmabot III when more than 10 sections are present.

2000 NRA Controversy

I'm wondering if this section of the article could be expanded some more? Since the NRA responded to the Attorney General's criticisms not with a retraction, but rather a series of 1997/98 figures from the Australian Bureau of Statistics, and local (Australian) newspaper articles which appeared to support their original claims. Yet in its current state this entry gives the impression that Daryl Williams duly reprimanded the NRA for spreading misinformation and that the story ended there.

That's also one example of a theme which I think the entry could explore more, namely the role Australian gun politics within the broader context of an international debate. Another such example would be televised debate between Rebecca Peters (who went on to work with IANSA following the 1996 reforms) and Wayne LaPierre in 2004. The Australian laws are now nearly 13 years old, and both sides within the international debate (whether in the US, Canada, the UK, Switzerland, etc) have used their own interpretations of these laws in their local political efforts. I'm not suggesting we need to go about listing a series of specific cases, just help to locate our debate within the larger picture.--TheCappy (talk) 07:45, 7 July 2009 (UTC)

Yes, there was more to say but the NRA effort really did suck. It was only propaganda to support their own prejudices, and discredited the NRA brand in Australia (not that our rampant political correctness gave them any credit you understand!) Australian media did not give their response the time of day, which might actually be good - it didn't help at all.

In the broader context, now is the time we should be able to make a contribution, and we are. WiSH have done well at South Pacific arms control conferences for instance.

If you have some useful stuff to add, go for it. I think that country paper story claiming '300% rise in murders' is a great example of the sort of bad work the debate is riddled with. ChrisPer (talk) 09:13, 7 July 2009 (UTC)

I'd also suggest- if anyone can find a reference- that mentioning the NRA's meddling has also hurt the NRAA (National Rifle Association of Australia), which is entirely unrelated to, and has totally separate goals and aims from, the US-based NRA. But they've got similar names, which is enough for some people, alas. Commander Zulu (talk) 09:44, 7 July 2009 (UTC)

I'm quite happy for the NRA to keep involving themselves, since any debate about the role of small arms in a society is pretty disingenuous if (like the SSAA) it never addresses the elephant in the room; namely their function in the defense of individual life and liberty.

It's fascinating how successful Australian gun control advocates have been in marginalising that position, to the extent that local shooters organisations aren't even willing to contest it for fear of being labeled extremists, and yet it is the raison d'être for small arms. So at least the NRA are keeping it in the collective consciousness until our local debate matures enough to start addressing it seriously.

Anyway they're personal musings; not something for a Misplaced Pages entry.--TheCappy (talk) 12:38, 7 July 2009 (UTC)

They are curious musings since Australians with less firearms have more life and liberty than Americans with more firearms. The US murder rate is three times ours. The US incarceration rate at ~770/100k is ~5-10 times any other industrialised nation (generally 50-150). 1 in 100 adults are currently in prison over there - a perhaps more salient explanation for their recent decrease in crime. As for personal freedoms, we're just as free here as over there, we just talk about it far, far less. There are a few things you can't do over here, a few you can't do over there, none of which are particularly necessary to getting on with your life. -59.167.194.48 (talk) 10:22, 28 July 2009 (UTC)

It is nothing but an opinion as to whether Americans or Australians have more "life and liberty." By your own figures of ~770 people incarcerated per 100,000, your statement that "1 in 100 adults are 'currently' in prison over there" is wrong. However, comparing Australia and the United States is impossible. For starters, the U.S. population is roughly 10X Australia's and the group making up the greatest percentage of U.S. inmates, African-Americans, outnumber the entire population of Australia. Also, the U.S. illegal alien population numbers at least 35% of the entire population of Australia and many estimates have this group numbering over 20 million which would be well over 50% of Australia's population. Finally, the areas in the U.S. from which the most people are incarcerated, have the fewest guns per capita, so U.S. crime and incarceration rates should have no bearing on Australian gun law politics.TL36 (talk) 02:54, 11 July 2014 (UTC)

Welcome TL36! Unfortunately the person you are disputing with made their remarks about 5 years ago and in any case wasn't worth arguing with in this venue. Feel free to suggest improvements for the article.ChrisPer (talk) 03:12, 11 July 2014 (UTC)

Great to have you with us! How about getting a user name and logging in? Your stats give us lots of diversions to follow, (eg Americans kill more people with non-gun methods than we do in total, so their society plainly is more to blame than guns alone) but most importantly please continue to help create a quality NPOV article! ChrisPer (talk) 03:52, 31 July 2009 (UTC)

why you talking about NRA thats not australian! --Kkkkkk8888 (talk) 10:03, 21 July 2016 (UTC)

Article moved/renamed without consultation

I consider the new name slightly better in some ways, but the old name was the actual subject of the article and consistent with names of similar articles on about 27 countries. The editor who moved the article also removed the main reference to the State Governments and State Police as participants in the issue, who respectively enact the laws and regulations, and enforce them. ChrisPer (talk) 04:58, 3 July 2015 (UTC) (Copied from the user's talk page)

In some countries, notably the US, it is more appropriate to use the description "gun politics". But in the case of Australia gun control is not really a contentious political issue. I understand that it is part of a series, but that is no reason to contort the wording of the article to correspond with the social issues and outlook in another country. Perhaps they should all be changed to "gun laws" which is more neutral. Having said that, I have no issue with a change back to "gun politics". It was just an attempt to make the article more relevant to the actual attitudes in the country. Enthusiast (talk) 11:59, 3 July 2015 (UTC)

That is a normal viewpoint, but not the whole picture. There are a couple of million Australians in households that own and use firearms, and they have had the fist of the law pressed to their noses for 20 years, their normal business greatly hampered by deliberate obstruction, plus self-righteous opprobrium from a chattering class who act as though people should not have different opinions to theirs. Australians have 800,000 gun licenses, 150,000 members in their largest organisation, formed a shooters' political party contesting elections in six states and federally, and are electing members to governments. This is not 'forcing the article to correspond to the social issues and outlook in another country' but dealing with Australian politics. The article was named politics, tagged as politics, and describes politics.

You are an awesome and fearless copy-editor and could be very good for this article but please, use the article Talk page to propose significant changes like moves, and to work with others. ChrisPer (talk) 22:52, 3 July 2015 (UTC)

'Major players' needs the only players with any actual power to be listed. A bucketload about the Feds has no meaning in the absence of mention of the States who have primary legal authority and act politically. ChrisPer (talk) 23:02, 3 July 2015 (UTC)

Sydney hostage crisis fallout

This edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request.

Please restore the section on the Sydney hostage crisis as of January. Please add to this section that in August 2015, Mike Baird and Troy Grant announced a tightening of laws on bail and illegal firearms, creating a new offence for the possession of a stolen firearm, with a maximum of 14 years imprisonment. An Illegal Firearms Investigation and Reward Scheme has also been announced, and there will be a ban on digital blueprints which allow 3D printers to make firearms. Thank you. --110.20.234.69 (talk) 08:55, 28 August 2015 (UTC)

References

https://www.nsw.gov.au/media-releases-premier/new-laws-combat-terrorism-and-illegal-firearms

Not done: The page's protection level and/or your user rights have changed since this request was placed. You should now be able to edit the page yourself. If you still seem to be unable to, please reopen the request with further details. -- Sam Sailor 15:55, 30 August 2015 (UTC)

Recent changes leave Port Arthur paragraphs indecipherable.

The numerous changes in the last two days have left terrible flow, and it's difficult to understand what the last few paragraphs in this section are saying at all. Several pieces of information have been included that decrease understanding instead of increasing it, for instance, what does the decreasing percentage of attacks using firearms matter if the percentage of attacks does not itself decrease?

It also appears (and I don't have the time to find out) that several more "facts" have been added that are not from the cited sources, or if they are, it's not clear how so.

My suggestion would be to revert to the edit labeled something like "added context" from Dec 4, but maybe I'm biased or too lazy to do all the typing myself. 2602:306:374D:8D60:C911:5303:9041:D7B9 (talk) 19:08, 6 December 2015 (UTC)

External links modified

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just added archive links to 2 external links on Gun laws in Australia. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add {{cbignore}} after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add {{nobots|deny=InternetArchiveBot}} to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:

Attempted to fix sourcing for http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/hicrc/files/2013/01/bulletins_australia_spring_2011.pdf
Added archive https://web.archive.org/20060613201931/http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au:80/story/0,20867,18950038-7583,00.html to http://theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,20867,18950038-7583,00.html

When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true to let others know.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 5 June 2024).

If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—_{Talk to my owner:Online} 14:20, 6 January 2016 (UTC)

Port Arthur massacre and its consequences-section

I rewrote the part with was subject to an edit conflicht now, because the existing text was partially editorializing and grossly misrepresenting its main source (the cnn article). An even better source actually linked in the cnn article is a 50 page paper by Neil/Leigh from 2012 (Do Gun Buybacks Save Lives?), which could be used to expand that paragraph.--Kmhkmh (talk) 08:32, 23 January 2016 (UTC)

Data source for chart?

The chart displayed approximately lined up with section 5 claims to show the murder rate from 1993 to 2014. However, neither of the url sources embedded at the bottom of the chart contain any data covering that interval. Furthermore, random sampling of the years shows that the values are incorrect, for example, the graph shows the 1993 homicide rate as slightly over 1.6/100k, while the actual value is 1.88/100k; the 2011 rate is shown as about 1.1/100k, while the actual value is 1.21/100k.

Please provide sources for all the data. As it stands it's synthesis, and it's using incorrect values. Anastrophe (talk) 03:34, 13 May 2016 (UTC)

Removing until properly sourced. Anastrophe (talk) 15:30, 13 May 2016 (UTC)

Our safety First

Its great they banned guns to protect us from a 30 deaths in 100 years case. When will the even more deadly weapon trucks be banned? Why wont the politicians protect us from trucks? Its not as if they are the smoking industry or alcohol industry which cost many times more lives each year and the gov losses Billions each year on. Or even the deadly privately owned weapons called cars which causes far more killing and damage each year and also the gov loses even more money on? Is guns and drugs the only thing the gov will ban and stop them causing any problems? Maybe the should make crimes illegal then they wont happen either.--Kkkkkk8888 (talk) 10:01, 21 July 2016 (UTC)

Make sure what you say on this talk page is to improve the article as per WP:Talk --SwiftyPeep (talk) 19:12, 13 December 2016 (UTC)

Gun control template

Per this discussion on the template talk page, I am removing the Gun politics by country template from this article, and this article from the template, because the article is not about politics. Scolaire (talk) 16:23, 4 September 2016 (UTC)

External links modified

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified 6 external links on Gun laws in Australia. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true or failed to let others know (documentation at {{Sourcecheck}}).

If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 00:42, 10 November 2016 (UTC)

This article does not outline THE ACTUAL GUN LAWS IN AUSTRALIA.

What specific allowances/restrictions are in place? Somebody please elaborate beyond firearm classification. Remember that politics is not the only point of interest in this subject.

Categories: